From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Tue Apr 12 13:28:04 1994
From: frodet@ulke.dhmolde.no (Frode Tennebo)
Message-Id: <9404121217.AA14376@ulke.dhmolde.no>
Subject: ETracker v2.3
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Tue, 12 Apr 1994 14:17:50 +0200 (MET DST)
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Just a quick note to inform you that E-Tracker v2.3 has been made availalb
for downloading. It's at /sam-coupe/music/etracker.zip - really worth getting
hold of. Many thanks to MAT of ESI. 

Also, some new net-disk are also available.

-- 
* Frode Tennebo                        * It's better to live life in     *
* email: frodet@ulke.dhmolde.no        * wealth and die poor, than live  * 
*        Frode.Tennebo@dhmolde.no      * life in poverty and die rich.   *
* snail: Parkv. 31, 6400 Molde, NORWAY *                   -Frode Tennebo*




From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Mon Apr 25 16:54:40 1994
From: Nigel J Kettlewell <N.J.Kettlewell@dcs.warwick.ac.uk>
Message-Id: <17737.199404251551@stone>
Subject: Bob Brenchley is a liar
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no (SAM Mailing list)
Date: Mon, 25 Apr 1994 16:51:42 +0100 (BST)
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Hello everybody. Are you sitting comfortably?
Good, then let's begin.

This is a story about a ridiculous man named Bob, a doormat and something I
decided wasn't really worth `alledging' any more, which caused quite a
revelation for poor old Sam out on the west coast.

Now, Bob runs a magazine in which people from software companies can
advertise anything they like, even if it's (may I say the word?) _games_.
Well, I decided to buy a game called "Legend of Eshan" because I thought it
sounded quite good from what I'd heard about it. So, I sent off my cheque
and a few days later it arrived - sounds good so far, eh?

Well, the trouble with the game was, that it didn't load - I got lots of
vertically scrolling coloured lines all over the screen, and a screeching
noise which was kind of off-putting.

Now, here's the funny thing. I had ordered the game from a company called
Revelation, but the little note came through saying `thankyou for your
order' from Format Publications. On the note it said that they would deal
with any problems, so I sent the disk back asking for a replacement as it
failed to load.

And I waited and waited, and grew very tired of waiting until one day I
decided that I was going to write to Bob and ask him why it was taking so
long to replace my disk.

Well, Jenny replied to me a short while later. I think Jenny is the name
Bob likes to go by when he's out of an evening. (tho for Christ's sake don't
quote me on that one, cos it's only a joke) Anyway, Jenny said that I hadn't
been sent my disk because I hadn't enclosed an SAE, and anyway, the disk
worked so she'd kindly sent it back to me.

I was furious. Why should I send them an SAE? After all, they'd sent me a
bad disk in the first place, and I didn't quite understand what the point in
sending me the same disk back again was, because funnily enough, it still
didn't work. "Well," I thought, "perhaps it's a fault with my disk drive."
So I cleaned the drive heads, and tried it again, and it still didn't work.
Then I tested some of my own disks, and they all worked just fine, so I wrote
to Bob again sending him an SAE this time and returning the disk once more.

Bob wrote back to me a little while later, explaining that the disk did work,
so my computer was broken. Well, as you can imagine, I was very annoyed. So I
wrote to Bob again, with another SAE to make sure that he would reply, and I
said "I want a replacement disk, or my money back" (make a note of that, as
I'll be asking questions later).

Anyway, I waited a little while, and then Frank wrote to me! I think Frank
is the name that Bob uses when he wants people to think that somebody else
is writing to them. Now, Frank (Broughton) is apparently something to do
with Revelation Software, so I was quite pleased, as I thought he'd sort it
all out. He didn't though - now do you remember my little quite a minute ago?
Good, because Frank sent me a credit note so I could buy something else from
Revelation, or Format or West Coast Computers. I didn't remember asking for
one of those.

OK, fun's over - this is my serious point...

Frank also said that Bob had sent me two different disks, and that if they
both failed then there must be something wrong with my computer. Unfortunately
Bob and Frank didn't notice the little black mark that I had put underneath
the write-protect tab on the disk which uniquely identified it from any other
disk. I was sent the same disk every time.

>From this I draw the conclusion that:

**************************************************************************
Bob Brenchley is a liar and you may put my name to that any time you like.
**************************************************************************

It's also worth noting that Format are handling all the orders for Revelation
and West Coast. Not only that, but the letter from Frank Broughton supposedly
from Exeter had a Gloucester postmark. In my opinion, this kind of proves that
Bob is running the whole outfit.

This is simply a warning to anybody who has seen the rumours about Bob
Brenchley, but hasn't ever had any bad experiences. That was exactly the
situation I was in until this fiasco, but now I am member number 1 of the
`I hate Bob Brenchley' club.

Is anybody going to the show in Gloucester next weekend? I'll be there, and
I'll have a few words to say to Mr Brenchley while I'm there...anybody been
to a fireworks display recently?

Bye
Nige



From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Mon Apr 25 17:13:44 1994
To: Nigel J Kettlewell <N.J.Kettlewell@dcs.warwick.ac.uk>,
        sam-users@nvg.unit.no
From: Simon Cooke <CSL@fs2.electrical-engineering.umist.ac.uk>
Date: 25 Apr 94 16:19:57 GMT
Subject: Re: Bob Brenchley is a liar
Priority: normal
X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail v2.3 (R4).
Message-Id: <64C790D3CD0@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk>
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> Frank also said that Bob had sent me two different disks, and that if they
> both failed then there must be something wrong with my computer. Unfortunately
> Bob and Frank didn't notice the little black mark that I had put underneath
> the write-protect tab on the disk which uniquely identified it from any other
> disk. I was sent the same disk every time.
>
> >From this I draw the conclusion that:
>
> **************************************************************************
> Bob Brenchley is a liar and you may put my name to that any time you like.
> **************************************************************************
>
> It's also worth noting that Format are handling all the orders for Revelation
> and West Coast. Not only that, but the letter from Frank Broughton supposedly
> from Exeter had a Gloucester postmark. In my opinion, this kind of proves that
> Bob is running the whole outfit.
>
> This is simply a warning to anybody who has seen the rumours about Bob
> Brenchley, but hasn't ever had any bad experiences. That was exactly the
> situation I was in until this fiasco, but now I am member number 1 of the
> `I hate Bob Brenchley' club.
>
> Is anybody going to the show in Gloucester next weekend? I'll be there, and
> I'll have a few words to say to Mr Brenchley while I'm there...anybody been
> to a fireworks display recently?

I had the same problems with The Driver. After sending "Frank"
explicit instructions on how to reproduce bugs, and telling him
exactly what needed to be done with it, I got the disc back "There is
nothing wrong with your disc" -- no shit, that's not what I sent it
there for.

The Driver is severely bugged, only one of which (the most cosmetic
one) is going to be fixed on the upgrade which, wait for it: Will be
announced in FRED and Format (neither of which I get), and will be
available (read as "will be sold to you") soon... apparently, even
though it's bugged beyond repair it's gaining many many fans...

Also, for a company in Exeter, I agree, Gloucester is a long way to
go to post your letters -- as the postmark from the reply I got told
me.

Notes:

1) Quote the law. You have consumer rights -- use them. If a product
is faulty, you may take it back to your retailer to get a refund or a
new, working copy. If something is sold in an unsaleable condition,
these still apply: also, in these cases, the retailer foots the bill
for any correspondance. Check me up on this, but I put a deadline of
28 days and explicit details saying I wasn't going to give them the
pleasure of an SAE because of said consumer rights..

2) Bob is stupid. Read Format letter pages for details.

3) We might well do ourselves a favour by boycotting him.

SImon Cooke

















+------------------INTERNET: CSL@FS2.EE.UMIST.AC.UK-------------------+
| "You know... you can tell someone's vain when they quote themselves |
|           in their own .sig file..." -- Simon Cooke                 |
+--------------------JANET: CSL@UK.AC.UMIST.EE.FS2--------------------+

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Mon Apr 25 17:26:53 1994
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
From: Simon Cooke <CSL@fs2.electrical-engineering.umist.ac.uk>
Date: 25 Apr 94 16:38:18 GMT
Subject: The MiDGET
Priority: normal
X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail v2.3 (R4).
Message-Id: <64CC7681584@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk>
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Roll up.. Roll up!

See a modern wondern captured and tamed for your Enjoyment!!

Watch as it scrolls around the screen as fluidly as the drifting snow,
Watch as it pulses at you in luminescent shades of 18-bit colour...
Watch as it displays its amazing 256 colour palette!

See it digitise and capture your very soul in its memory chips in 64
shades of gray!

See it mix your image with a computer-created background of your
choice!

See it display its graphics above a moving video image background!

Watch it display VGA graphics in astounding detail...

And there's more...

But we ain't gonna tell you.

You're gonna have to go

To the FORMAT show...

Or read Prime 7 :) :) :)

Si Cooke
+------------------INTERNET: CSL@FS2.EE.UMIST.AC.UK-------------------+
| "You know... you can tell someone's vain when they quote themselves |
|           in their own .sig file..." -- Simon Cooke                 |
+--------------------JANET: CSL@UK.AC.UMIST.EE.FS2--------------------+

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Mon Apr 25 20:30:15 1994
From: frodet@ulke.dhmolde.no (Frode Tennebo)
Message-Id: <9404251927.AA11897@ulke.dhmolde.no>
Subject: Re: Bob Brenchley is a liar
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Mon, 25 Apr 1994 21:27:12 +0200 (MET DST)
In-Reply-To: <64C790D3CD0@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk> from "Simon Cooke" at Apr 25, 94 04:19:57 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21]
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> 3) We might well do ourselves a favour by boycotting him.

What sort of favour? Somebody must retail the SAM related stuff.
But those of you who are going to the Glouc. show, can't they
tell Bob some words from the liver?

I myself have set 5 faxes to Bob with only one reply to my
ASIC problem. I still don't know what to do with it, and I'm 
getting a bit frustrated.

-- 
* Frode Tennebo                        * It's better to live life in     *
* email: frodet@ulke.dhmolde.no        * wealth and die poor, than live  * 
*        Frode.Tennebo@dhmolde.no      * life in poverty and die rich.   *
* snail: Parkv. 31, 6400 Molde, NORWAY *                   -Frode Tennebo*

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Mon Apr 25 20:32:53 1994
From: frodet@ulke.dhmolde.no (Frode Tennebo)
Message-Id: <9404251931.AA11930@ulke.dhmolde.no>
Subject: Re: The MiDGET
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Mon, 25 Apr 1994 21:31:48 +0200 (MET DST)
In-Reply-To: <64CC7681584@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk> from "Simon Cooke" at Apr 25, 94 04:38:18 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21]
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> 
> Roll up.. Roll up!
> 
> See a modern wondern captured and tamed for your Enjoyment!!
> 
> Watch as it scrolls around the screen as fluidly as the drifting snow,
> Watch as it pulses at you in luminescent shades of 18-bit colour...
> Watch as it displays its amazing 256 colour palette!
> 
> See it digitise and capture your very soul in its memory chips in 64
> shades of gray!
> 
> See it mix your image with a computer-created background of your
> choice!
> 
> See it display its graphics above a moving video image background!
> 
> Watch it display VGA graphics in astounding detail...
> 
> And there's more...
> 
> But we ain't gonna tell you.
> 
> You're gonna have to go
> 
> To the FORMAT show...

'I have troubles comming' (qoute my OOSD-book)

> Or read Prime 7 :) :) :)

What about filling us in?

-- 
* Frode Tennebo                        * It's better to live life in     *
* email: frodet@ulke.dhmolde.no        * wealth and die poor, than live  * 
*        Frode.Tennebo@dhmolde.no      * life in poverty and die rich.   *
* snail: Parkv. 31, 6400 Molde, NORWAY *                   -Frode Tennebo*

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Mon Apr 25 20:39:33 1994
From: frodet@ulke.dhmolde.no (Frode Tennebo)
Message-Id: <9404251938.AA11967@ulke.dhmolde.no>
Subject: Re: Bob Brenchley is a liar
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Mon, 25 Apr 1994 21:38:02 +0200 (MET DST)
In-Reply-To: <swordfish.767294848@minster.york.ac.uk> from "Geoff Winkless" at Apr 25, 94 06:05:07 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21]
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> 
> On Apr 25,  4:51pm in "Bob Brenchley is a liar", you warbled:
> ] Is anybody going to the show in Gloucester next weekend? I'll be there, and
> ] I'll have a few words to say to Mr Brenchley while I'm there...anybody been
> ] to a fireworks display recently?
> 
> Yep. I'll be there, even though it costs 25 quid with a student railcard from
> york.

It would set ME back about 300 quid, so you have nothing to moan about. :)


-- 
* Frode Tennebo                        * It's better to live life in     *
* email: frodet@ulke.dhmolde.no        * wealth and die poor, than live  * 
*        Frode.Tennebo@dhmolde.no      * life in poverty and die rich.   *
* snail: Parkv. 31, 6400 Molde, NORWAY *                   -Frode Tennebo*

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Mon Apr 25 20:40:35 1994
Message-Id: <swordfish.767294848@minster.york.ac.uk>
From: gaw-a@minster.york.ac.uk (Geoff Winkless)
Date: Mon, 25 Apr 1994 18:05:07 +0100
In-Reply-To: N.J.Kettlewell -- "Bob Brenchley is a liar" (Apr 25, 4:51pm)
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92 (ORBIT))
To: sam-users <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Subject: Re: Bob Brenchley is a liar
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On Apr 25,  4:51pm in "Bob Brenchley is a liar", you warbled:
] Is anybody going to the show in Gloucester next weekend? I'll be there, and
] I'll have a few words to say to Mr Brenchley while I'm there...anybody been
] to a fireworks display recently?

Yep. I'll be there, even though it costs 25 quid with a student railcard from
york.

Now the question is, does any kind soul have any idea how to get to the
show from Glouc. station?

Geoff 		        (gaw-a@minster.york.ac.uk / gaw2@york.ac.uk -- INET)
       __  __   __  An  expert  is  someone | I may be wrong: I thought we said
|\  /||  ||  ) ( _) who can read the system | It couldn't happen here... -  PSB
||\/|||--||-(  _\\  manual   pages   faster | These  opinions  are  my  own. If
||  |||  ||  \(__/  than anyone else...     | anyone  agrees,  more  fool them.


From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Tue Apr 26 11:48:36 1994
Date: Tue, 26 Apr 1994 12:37:21 +0200
X400-Originator: cgp@uk.ac.st-andrews
X400-Recipients: sam-users@no.unit.nvg
X400-Mts-Identifier: [/PRMD=UK.AC/ADMD= /C=GB/;<18287.9404261037@pasta.st-andre]
X400-Content-Type: P2-1984 (2)
Content-Identifier: INFO SERVER -...
From: Colin G Piggot <cgp@st-andrews.ac.uk>
Message-Id: <18287.9404261037@pasta.st-andrews.ac.uk>
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Subject: INFO SERVER - USERS SERVEY
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Remember the user's survey many of you saw on the Sam Info Server?
(Telnet : 138.251.11.5 4111). Well only two people (yes TWO!) cared to
reply. So here are the results (based on these TWO peoples answers).

BEST PROGRAMS:
= COMET ASSEMBLER (Revelation)=
= PRINCE OF PERSIA (Domark)=

BEST DEMO:
= SURPRISE (ESI) =

Obviously with only 2 peoples answers i cannot really do a large chart with
various sections (like i was originally going to do) but i'd still appriciate
peoples answers - see section 19 on the server.

Colin Piggot.

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Tue Apr 26 12:08:42 1994
Via: davinci.ecs.soton.ac.uk; Tue, 26 Apr 94 11:40:59 BST
From: Stephen Longhurst <sl92@ecs.southampton.ac.uk>
Message-Id: <1069.9404261040@vermeer.ecs.soton.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Bob Brenchley is a liar and Format show
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Tue, 26 Apr 1994 11:40:07 +0100 (BST)
In-Reply-To: <swordfish.767294848@minster.york.ac.uk> from "Geoff Winkless" at Apr 25, 94 06:05:07 pm
X-Face: 7V9lcvSxvzDzrcwxpo9'}$H9n@@!P'YK-hZwj|:Ih$IV8cp~VDtMl6=00MTiUjBVk4v%fx_ 
        W[ITB~O`7g&/E%aLI&$?*)Xn#=z0j$QIdEJ],(Nh65&~Dc$<cUH&0vYKx<|Sj#jW?P;DNoDz,TFUXu 
        #![xmg~)k5qd^70mkbuhR9W914:d.`kY'wDY%}cqO=>M{i{?~Ar9#Ms8@'g,
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Geoff Winkless writes:
> 
> On Apr 25,  4:51pm in "Bob Brenchley is a liar", you warbled:
> ] Is anybody going to the show in Gloucester next weekend? I'll be there, and
> ] I'll have a few words to say to Mr Brenchley while I'm there...anybody been
> ] to a fireworks display recently?
> 
> Yep. I'll be there, even though it costs 25 quid with a student railcard from
> york.
> 
> Now the question is, does any kind soul have any idea how to get to the
> show from Glouc. station?
> 
Can anyone give me the exact date and the place for the formentioned show
please.  If I can make it then I could also offer anybody a lift if they live
between Southampton and Gloucester.  It depends when it is though.

Cheers,
		Steve

After all is said and done, a lot more has been said than 
done. 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Stephen Longhurst         sl92@ecs.soton.ac.uk        2nd Year Computer Science 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Tue Apr 26 13:35:33 1994
Date: Tue, 26 Apr 1994 12:17:01 +0200
X400-Originator: cgp@uk.ac.st-andrews
X400-Recipients: sam-users@no.unit.nvg
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X400-Content-Type: P2-1984 (2)
Content-Identifier: Re: Bob Brenc...
From: Colin G Piggot <cgp@st-andrews.ac.uk>
Message-Id: <17608.9404261017@pasta.st-andrews.ac.uk>
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Subject: Re: Bob Brenchley is a liar
Reply-To: 
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Status: RO
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On Mon Apr 25 Simon Cooke said:

> The Driver is severely bugged, only one of which (the most cosmetic
> one) is going to be fixed on the upgrade which, wait for it: Will be
> announced in FRED and Format (neither of which I get), and will be
> available (read as "will be sold to you") soon... apparently, even
> though it's bugged beyond repair it's gaining many many fans...

Well (unfortunately!) I subscribed to both when i first got my Sam 13 months
ago and (wait for it...!) there has been NO mention of any bugs or
new versions in any text or adverts.

As for enclosing a SAE - Bob's said that many times in DoorMat.

> 2) Bob is stupid. Read Format letter pages for details.

Oh yes! Bob's wittering about this that and the next thing... 
Lets see what are the classic sayings from the letters page.....

'Nobody wants stupid demos', 'Dont call me a Pessimist but i feel that
no new hardware will appear' - talking about various pieces hardware (I
cant wait to see his face when he sees the MiDGET at the Glouceseter show'!

'Nobody needs hardware scrolling', 'Samples are not needed - Programmers should
use the sound chip properly'

In reply all i say in reply is can someone call the funny farm on his behalf?

Colin Piggot.


From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Tue Apr 26 15:28:01 1994
Date: Tue, 26 Apr 1994 15:36:55 +0200
X400-Originator: cgp@uk.ac.st-andrews
X400-Recipients: sam-users@no.unit.nvg
X400-Mts-Identifier: [/PRMD=UK.AC/ADMD= /C=GB/;<22629.9404261336@pasta.st-andre]
X400-Content-Type: P2-1984 (2)
Content-Identifier: Re: Bob Brenc...
From: Colin G Piggot <cgp@st-andrews.ac.uk>
Message-Id: <22629.9404261336@pasta.st-andrews.ac.uk>
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Subject: Re: Bob Brenchley is a liar and Format show
Reply-To: 
Pp-Warning: Parse error in original version of preceding line
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Status: RO
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Stephen Longhurst writes:

> Can anyone give me the exact date and the place for the formentioned show
> please.

Forgot the place in the last letter - Its at Quedgely Village Hall
somewhere in Gloucester.

Colni Piggot.

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Tue Apr 26 15:50:59 1994
From: Robert Partington <partingr@cs.man.ac.uk>
Message-Id: <9404261447.AA00605@t1n.cs.man.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: The MiDGET
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Tue, 26 Apr 1994 15:47:30 +0100 (BST)
In-Reply-To: <64CC7681584@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk> from "Simon Cooke" at Apr 25, 94 04:38:18 pm
Risc-Header: ARMed
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23]
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Where's the FORMAT show then?

rob the clueless
Rob Partington            .o 0 0 0        ____    Along the mountain road,
partingr@cs.man.ac.uk   _||              / __ \   Somehow it tugs at my heart:
My opinions...        _/o o\___        __|_||_|__ A wild violet.
~~~~~~~~\O/~~~~~~~~~~~\_______/~~~~~~~/              Matsuo Basho 1644-1694

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Tue Apr 26 15:53:01 1994
From: Nigel J Kettlewell <N.J.Kettlewell@dcs.warwick.ac.uk>
Message-Id: <8967.199404261450@stone>
Subject: Re: The MiDGET
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Tue, 26 Apr 1994 15:50:52 +0100 (BST)
In-Reply-To: <64CC7681584@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk> from "Simon Cooke" at Apr 25, 94 16:38:18 pm
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> 
> Roll up.. Roll up!

In my Rolls...
(in my dreams...)

> 
> See a modern wondern captured and tamed for your Enjoyment!!
> 
> Watch as it scrolls around the screen as fluidly as the drifting snow,

But drifting snow isn't really very fluid, by its very definition...

> Watch as it pulses at you in luminescent shades of 18-bit colour...

the 24-bit thing isn't needed any more then? I remember DL going on about it
the way he does...

> Watch as it displays its amazing 256 colour palette!

So, twice as many colours as SAM, then?

> 
> See it digitise and capture your very soul in its memory chips in 64
> shades of gray!
> 

1/4 of which are grey...

> See it mix your image with a computer-created background of your
> choice!
> 

Now that I am looking forward to seeing.

> See it display its graphics above a moving video image background!
> 
> Watch it display VGA graphics in astounding detail...
> 
> And there's more...
> 
> But we ain't gonna tell you.
> 
> You're gonna have to go
> 
> To the FORMAT show...
> 
> Or read Prime 7 :) :) :)
> 

This little gadget _does_ sound tres good and damn fine to boot, and
hopefully we'll show Bob a thing or two...

> Si Cooke

Bye
Nige



From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Tue Apr 26 15:57:45 1994
From: Nigel J Kettlewell <N.J.Kettlewell@dcs.warwick.ac.uk>
Message-Id: <9675.199404261457@stone>
Subject: Re: The MiDGET
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Tue, 26 Apr 1994 15:57:08 +0100 (BST)
In-Reply-To: <9404261447.AA00605@t1n.cs.man.ac.uk> from "Robert Partington" at Apr 26, 94 15:47:30 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL20]
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> 
> Where's the FORMAT show then?

Gloucester, April 30th - more directions to come --- watch this space

> 
> rob the clueless
> Rob Partington            .o 0 0 0        ____    Along the mountain road,
> partingr@cs.man.ac.uk   _||              / __ \   Somehow it tugs at my heart:
> My opinions...        _/o o\___        __|_||_|__ A wild violet.
> ~~~~~~~~\O/~~~~~~~~~~~\_______/~~~~~~~/              Matsuo Basho 1644-1694
> 

Back to the functional programming... (aaaarrrrgggghhh)
Nige




From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Tue Apr 26 16:10:46 1994
From: Nigel J Kettlewell <N.J.Kettlewell@dcs.warwick.ac.uk>
Message-Id: <2790.199404261359@stone>
Subject: Wow!
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no (SAM Mailing list)
Date: Tue, 26 Apr 1994 14:59:24 +0100 (BST)
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL20]
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Wow! Talk about kickstarting this mailing list!

In reply to Stephen Longhurst's query, the show in Gloucester is on Saturday
April 30th (this Saturday) and it's in Quedgley village hall, or something.
I'll mail the transport details that are in Format next time I log on.

Somebody mentioned that Bob has said that he wants SAEs if people are going to
get things sent back to them - this tends, however, to be things that people
haven't actually paid for in the first place...

Bye
Nige




From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Tue Apr 26 16:28:45 1994
From: Nigel J Kettlewell <N.J.Kettlewell@dcs.warwick.ac.uk>
Message-Id: <12300.199404261523@stone>
Subject: Re: INFO SERVER - USERS SERVEY
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Tue, 26 Apr 1994 16:23:43 +0100 (BST)
In-Reply-To: <18287.9404261037@pasta.st-andrews.ac.uk> from "Colin G Piggot" at Apr 26, 94 12:37:21 pm
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> 
> Remember the user's survey many of you saw on the Sam Info Server?
> (Telnet : 138.251.11.5 4111). Well only two people (yes TWO!) cared to
> reply. So here are the results (based on these TWO peoples answers).
> 
> BEST PROGRAMS:
> = COMET ASSEMBLER (Revelation)=
> = PRINCE OF PERSIA (Domark)=
> 
> BEST DEMO:
> = SURPRISE (ESI) =
> 
> Obviously with only 2 peoples answers i cannot really do a large chart with
> various sections (like i was originally going to do) but i'd still appriciate
> peoples answers - see section 19 on the server.

I was one of the people that answered...
Come on you lot, support your SAM. I may have given up on my favourite person,
but I'm sticking with blue feet all the way (and I've got an Amiga 4000/030 as
well, so SAM must have _something_ going for it...)

> 
> Colin Piggot.
> 

Bye
Nige




From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Tue Apr 26 17:12:59 1994
Date: Tue, 26 Apr 1994 15:29:32 +0200
X400-Originator: cgp@uk.ac.st-andrews
X400-Recipients: sam-users@no.unit.nvg
X400-Mts-Identifier: [/PRMD=UK.AC/ADMD= /C=GB/;<22326.9404261329@pasta.st-andre]
X400-Content-Type: P2-1984 (2)
Content-Identifier: Re: Bob Brenc...
From: Colin G Piggot <cgp@st-andrews.ac.uk>
Message-Id: <22326.9404261329@pasta.st-andrews.ac.uk>
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Subject: Re: Bob Brenchley is a liar and Format show
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Stephen Longhurst writes:

> Can anyone give me the exact date and the place for the formentioned show
> please.  If I can make it then I could also offer anybody a lift if they live
> between Southampton and Gloucester.  It depends when it is though.

Its on the 30th April (4 days time...) from 10.30 to 4.30.
Tickets are 2 quid at the door.

Geoff Winkless writes:

> Now the question is, does any kind soul have any idea how to get to the
> show from Glouc. station?

According to Bob the bus station is next to the railway station and
buses leave in the direction requied every 10 mins or so. Bob states that
you should get off at the Tesco supermarket and the hall is nearby.

Colin Piggot.

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Wed Apr 27 12:23:27 1994
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no, nigket@dcs.warwick.ac.uk
From: Simon Cooke <CSL@fs2.electrical-engineering.umist.ac.uk>
Date: 27 Apr 94 11:32:51 GMT
Subject: Re: The MiDGET
Priority: normal
X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail v2.3 (R4).
Message-Id: <677B17D7998@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk>
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> > *grins* well... I'm writing lots of SAM file conversion utils...
> > GIF's take **HOURS** to decode though, which is a pain, and I've got
> > to finish my new DOS before I do any more, so that I can serially
> > access the files I want to with ease and precision.
>
> In about 9 1/2 weeks time, I can do some conversions to BMP for you, if
> they're any use by then...

Maybe... I'm using the PC's here to do it tho', so unless you're
converting JPEGs...

> The Amiga can be a tad slow on GIFs as well, tho it's converting from chunky
> format to planar, so that kind of explains some of the slowness. ADPro is
> much quicker tho.

Mmmm... still doesn't explain the slowness of the SAM.

> > Indeed. The air was filled with language thick and ripe :)
> Thats sounds almost poetic, tho I imagine it didn't at the time...

Nope -- it didn't!!

BTW: Poetry 'cos I'm writing a novel... 80 pages and still going
strong :)

> > > > so I'm off to Maplin's in a mo' to buy a new one... if we can't get
> > > > one... Well.... we'll have to build it out of discrete components --
> > > > giving 8x256 colour look up tables (selectable using a single OUT to
> > > > switch between them), and it'll be 24-bit... still... could be worse.
> > >
> > > I don't envy you. Yes it could be worse, I suppose, you could have some bits
> > > left over once you've finished putting it all together :)
> >
> > *grins*

DAMN! They didn't have any!!! So now I've got 2x8bit DACs, and we
have to build the blue one out of resistors :( :( :(

> > > > Wellllll..... it's because the blue section of light is the one we
> > > > don't see that well... the eye responds in this fraction:
> > > >
> > > > 0.17 Blue
> > > > 0.53 Green
> > > > 0.40 Red -- or something like that..
> > >
> > > Wow. Did you learn that in your physics course?
> >
> > Believe it or not, but no -- it's in TV technical manuals and books
> > on physiology and eye receptiveness etc etc... Strange really. So I
> > just kind of picked it up :)
>
> Hmm. I never read the instructions on my telly, and I don't think I've ever
> seen a TV tech manual, but fair enough.

*grins* It's in there... as well as lots of other fun things like
resolving powers of the eye etc -- depends on the technical manual
though...

> > **** OTHER PEOPLE PLEASE JOIN IN!!! ****
> >
>
> I think this may be a lost cause...

Me too. Pass the embalming fluid, garcon.

> Is _anybody_ interested in discussing new SAM hardware?
> I may well end up spending a big chunk of my grant (I'm a poor, starving
> student) on the Midget, and I'd like to believe other people are actually
> interested.

Yup... maybe they're all hiding and hoping we'll go away? :)

Si
+------------------INTERNET: CSL@FS2.EE.UMIST.AC.UK-------------------+
| "You know... you can tell someone's vain when they quote themselves |
|           in their own .sig file..." -- Simon Cooke                 |
+--------------------JANET: CSL@UK.AC.UMIST.EE.FS2--------------------+

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Wed Apr 27 13:40:58 1994
From: frodet@ulke.dhmolde.no (Frode Tennebo)
Message-Id: <9404271238.AA24128@ulke.dhmolde.no>
Subject: BBB ?
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Wed, 27 Apr 1994 14:38:07 +0200 (MET DST)
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21]
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Some questions have been raised in this forum about how 'Big Bad Bob' has
been handeling the affairs of Revelation and West Coast Computers. Now,
I have been waiting for a certain fax from him for two months or so, and
guess what - I got it the other day :)

First of all, it has never been a secret that Format is handeling the
shipping of the goods for Revelation and WCC, and that Blue Alpha
is handeling assembly/repairs. In his fax, Bob mentiones that BA has
been on the move for some time, but has now settled down again, and
claims this to be the reason for the recent fuck-up (not his exact
words, though....). I don't know whether this is true or not, but at
least I think we can give the man a chance. After all, he has put a lot
of effort into a, though great computer, commercial failure.

Now, I would stil like to support the SAM, but the question is: Do
I fork out 110 quid for Legend of Ashran, Driver, SAMPaint, Lemmings
and a new ASIC? Now, I can even pay in Norwegian bank-notes. :)

Apropos ASIC; some rumours have been floating around that the stock
of ASICs are empty. This is not true according to Bob, more than 6000
are in store.
 
-- 
* Frode Tennebo                        * It's better to live life in     *
* email: frodet@ulke.dhmolde.no        * wealth and die poor, than live  * 
*        Frode.Tennebo@dhmolde.no      * life in poverty and die rich.   *
* snail: Parkv. 31, 6400 Molde, NORWAY *                   -Frode Tennebo*

From imc Wed Apr 27 13:52:27 1994
Subject: Re: The MiDGET
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Wed, 27 Apr 94 13:52:27 BST
In-Reply-To: <677B17D7998@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk>; from "Simon Cooke" at Apr 27, 94 11:32 am
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]
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On 27 Apr 94 11:32:51 GMT, Simon Cooke said:

[lots of quotes up to a depth of about 5!]

I haven't seen a single one of the quoted articles, and it's rather
confusing to be thrown right into the middle of *this* conversation!  ;-)

> > > **** OTHER PEOPLE PLEASE JOIN IN!!! ****

> > I think this may be a lost cause...

Well that explains why *I* didn't join in, at least.

imc

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Wed Apr 27 13:54:23 1994
From: Nigel J Kettlewell <N.J.Kettlewell@dcs.warwick.ac.uk>
Message-Id: <14910.199404271252@stone>
Subject: Re: BBB ?
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Wed, 27 Apr 1994 13:52:27 +0100 (BST)
In-Reply-To: <9404271238.AA24128@ulke.dhmolde.no> from "Frode Tennebo" at Apr 27, 94 14:38:07 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL20]
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> 
> Some questions have been raised in this forum about how 'Big Bad Bob' has
> been handeling the affairs of Revelation and West Coast Computers.
> 
> First of all, it has never been a secret that Format is handeling the
> shipping of the goods for Revelation and WCC, and that Blue Alpha
> is handeling assembly/repairs. In his fax, Bob mentiones that BA has
> been on the move for some time, but has now settled down again, and
> claims this to be the reason for the recent fuck-up (not his exact
> words, though....). I don't know whether this is true or not, but at
> least I think we can give the man a chance. After all, he has put a lot
> of effort into a, though great computer, commercial failure.

That was exactly the way I felt until he started messing me about. You say
that he's put a lot of effort into the SAM. Well, I'm not so sure - what
has he achieved exactly?

> 
> Now, I would stil like to support the SAM, but the question is: Do
> I fork out 110 quid for Legend of Ashran, Driver, SAMPaint, Lemmings
> and a new ASIC? Now, I can even pay in Norwegian bank-notes. :)
> 

Buy them one at a time, maybe? I've seen Lemmings and it is a very faithful
conversion - a really fine piece of programming. Trouble is, I've got Lems,
O No More Lems & Lems II on my Amiga, so I'm not really going to buy it...

SAMPaint is also v good, but somebody mentioned on this very mailing list
that Driver is seriously flawed. Legend of Eshan? Who knows. I'm still
waiting...

> Apropos ASIC; some rumours have been floating around that the stock
> of ASICs are empty. This is not true according to Bob, more than 6000
> are in store.
>  

The trouble is, that as I said, Bob is a liar, and I simply do not trust
anything he says any more.

> -- 
> * Frode Tennebo

Nige



From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Wed Apr 27 14:10:31 1994
Message-Id: <swordfish.767452170@minster.york.ac.uk>
From: gaw-a@minster.york.ac.uk (Geoff Winkless)
Date: Wed, 27 Apr 1994 13:52:04 +0100
In-Reply-To: CSL -- "Re: The MiDGET" (Apr 27, 11:32am)
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92 (ORBIT))
To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Subject: Re: The MiDGET
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
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Umm... just exactly what does this tell us? The bit at the bottom about
other people joining in? I never saw any of this before...

As to display chips... I think the chip you were using was actually used
in the first Archimedes... don't quote me on that though...

:-)

Geoff 		        (gaw-a@minster.york.ac.uk / gaw2@york.ac.uk -- INET)
       __  __   __  An  expert  is  someone | I may be wrong: I thought we said
|\  /||  ||  ) ( _) who can read the system | It couldn't happen here... -  PSB
||\/|||--||-(  _\\  manual   pages   faster | These  opinions  are  my  own. If
||  |||  ||  \(__/  than anyone else...     | anyone  agrees,  more  fool them.


From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Wed Apr 27 14:15:48 1994
From: Nigel J Kettlewell <N.J.Kettlewell@dcs.warwick.ac.uk>
Message-Id: <18696.199404271314@stone>
Subject: Re: The MiDGET
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Wed, 27 Apr 1994 14:14:47 +0100 (BST)
In-Reply-To: <swordfish.767452170@minster.york.ac.uk> from "Geoff Winkless" at Apr 27, 94 13:52:04 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL20]
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> 
> Umm... just exactly what does this tell us? The bit at the bottom about
> other people joining in? I never saw any of this before...

What does what tell you? OK, so we've been rattling off quite a few messages
over the past two days - I think Simon and I tend to be logged on at much the
same times as each other.

> 
> As to display chips... I think the chip you were using was actually used
> in the first Archimedes... don't quote me on that though...
> 
> :-)
> 

Well, well, well. What are the graphics capabilities of the Arc like? I know
that the machine is a bit nippy when it comes to number crunching, but I never
really saw anything graphical.

> Geoff

Nige



From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Wed Apr 27 14:31:58 1994
From: Nigel J Kettlewell <N.J.Kettlewell@dcs.warwick.ac.uk>
Message-Id: <21294.199404271331@stone>
Subject: Re: The MiDGET
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Wed, 27 Apr 1994 14:31:22 +0100 (BST)
In-Reply-To: <9404271252.AA08137@booth3.ecs.ox.ac.uk> from "Ian.Collier@comlab.ox.ac.uk" at Apr 27, 94 14:52:27 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL20]
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Status: RO
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> 
> On 27 Apr 94 11:32:51 GMT, Simon Cooke said:
> 
> [lots of quotes up to a depth of about 5!]
> 
> I haven't seen a single one of the quoted articles, and it's rather
> confusing to be thrown right into the middle of *this* conversation!  ;-)

Funny. They've all been posted to the mailing list, so you should have got
them if you subscribe...

There's something weird going on here...

> 
> > > > **** OTHER PEOPLE PLEASE JOIN IN!!! ****
> 
> > > I think this may be a lost cause...
> 
> Well that explains why *I* didn't join in, at least.
> 

Apologies.

> imc
> 

Nige



From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Wed Apr 27 15:03:54 1994
Message-Id: <swordfish.767455292@minster.york.ac.uk>
From: gaw-a@minster.york.ac.uk (Geoff Winkless)
Date: Wed, 27 Apr 1994 14:44:24 +0100
In-Reply-To: N.J.Kettlewell -- "Re: The MiDGET" (Apr 27, 2:14pm)
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92 (ORBIT))
To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Subject: Re: The MiDGET
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 1576
Lines: 38

On Apr 27,  2:14pm in "Re: The MiDGET", you warbled:
 
] What does what tell you? OK, so we've been rattling off quite a few messages
] over the past two days - I think Simon and I tend to be logged on at much the
] same times as each other.

But was anyone else reading them? I didn't see them... oh well.

Oh yeah, and Simon is refusing to answer my mail. *sigh*

] > As to display chips... I think the chip you were using was actually used
] > in the first Archimedes... don't quote me on that though...
] 
] Well, well, well. What are the graphics capabilities of the Arc like? I know
] that the machine is a bit nippy when it comes to number crunching, but I never
] really saw anything graphical.

The words `very very nice' spring to mind...

Especially the latest set, which have little to do with that chip. Was it the
Hitachi one?

Oh yeah, talking of the Arch... if anyone owns one, read the various reviews
of KV in last months (April's) mags -- the bits about the music and sound.
Not a lot of people know this, but I co-wrote the music...

`The sound is the best feature of this game'
`Buy it'
-- Acorn User

<<< is *well* chuffed.

Geoff 		        (gaw-a@minster.york.ac.uk / gaw2@york.ac.uk -- INET)
       __  __   __  An  expert  is  someone | I may be wrong: I thought we said
|\  /||  ||  ) ( _) who can read the system | It couldn't happen here... -  PSB
||\/|||--||-(  _\\  manual   pages   faster | These  opinions  are  my  own. If
||  |||  ||  \(__/  than anyone else...     | anyone  agrees,  more  fool them.


From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Wed Apr 27 15:30:36 1994
Date: Wed, 27 Apr 1994 15:48:08 +0200
X400-Originator: cgp@uk.ac.st-andrews
X400-Recipients: sam-users@no.unit.nvg
X400-Mts-Identifier: [/PRMD=UK.AC/ADMD= /C=GB/;<9739.9404271348@pasta.st-andrew]
X400-Content-Type: P2-1984 (2)
Content-Identifier: Re: BBB ?
From: Colin G Piggot <cgp@st-andrews.ac.uk>
Message-Id: <9739.9404271348@pasta.st-andrews.ac.uk>
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Subject: Re: BBB ?
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 664
Lines: 19


> Apropos ASIC; some rumours have been floating around that the stock
> of ASICs are empty. This is not true according to Bob, more than 6000
> are in store.

As far as i know, there are still largish (couple thousand at least) ASIC's
in store.

> Now, I would stil like to support the SAM, but the question is: Do
> I fork out 110 quid for Legend of Ashran, Driver, SAMPaint, Lemmings
> and a new ASIC? Now, I can even pay in Norwegian bank-notes. :)

Why would you want to buy a new ASIC - there is only one version
of it?

Right! Lemmings is great - buy it! SAMpaint is also great!

As for the others i dont know because i dont have them.


From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Wed Apr 27 15:44:12 1994
Message-Id: <swordfish.767457769@minster.york.ac.uk>
From: gaw-a@minster.york.ac.uk (Geoff Winkless)
Date: Wed, 27 Apr 1994 15:25:19 +0100
In-Reply-To: N.J.Kettlewell -- "Re: The MiDGET" (Apr 27, 2:31pm)
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92 (ORBIT))
To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Subject: Re: The MiDGET
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 1220
Lines: 33

On Apr 27,  2:31pm in "Re: The MiDGET", you warbled:
] > 
] > On 27 Apr 94 11:32:51 GMT, Simon Cooke said:
] > 
] > [lots of quotes up to a depth of about 5!]
] > 
] > I haven't seen a single one of the quoted articles, and it's rather
] > confusing to be thrown right into the middle of *this* conversation!  ;-)
] 
] Funny. They've all been posted to the mailing list, so you should have got
] them if you subscribe...
] 
] There's something weird going on here...

What's the betting they've been using reply-to-all instead of just
reply-to-sender...

which means that they won't have noticed that the reply line is still
fucked-up...

Can something be done about that, btw, arnt?

Certainly my mailer (at least) needs an extra `>' on the end of the
<sam-users@ftp.nvg.unit.no bit

Cheers...

Geoff 		        (gaw-a@minster.york.ac.uk / gaw2@york.ac.uk -- INET)
       __  __   __  An  expert  is  someone | I may be wrong: I thought we said
|\  /||  ||  ) ( _) who can read the system | It couldn't happen here... -  PSB
||\/|||--||-(  _\\  manual   pages   faster | These  opinions  are  my  own. If
||  |||  ||  \(__/  than anyone else...     | anyone  agrees,  more  fool them.


From imc Wed Apr 27 16:12:35 1994
Subject: Re: The MiDGET
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Wed, 27 Apr 94 16:12:35 BST
In-Reply-To: <swordfish.767457769@minster.york.ac.uk>; from "Geoff Winkless" at Apr 27, 94 3:25 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]
Content-Length: 475
Lines: 17

On Wed, 27 Apr 1994 15:25:19 +0100, Geoff Winkless said:

> What's the betting they've been using reply-to-all instead of just
> reply-to-sender...

> which means that they won't have noticed that the reply line is still
> fucked-up...

> Can something be done about that, btw, arnt?

Not any more, it's not.  Which probably explains why that last note did
arrive.

I mailed sam-users-request about it yesterday, and it seems to be fixed now
(thanks).

imc

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Wed Apr 27 16:55:05 1994
From: frodet@ulke.dhmolde.no (Frode Tennebo)
Message-Id: <9404271553.AA26866@ulke.dhmolde.no>
Subject: Re: BBB ?
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Wed, 27 Apr 1994 17:53:07 +0200 (MET DST)
In-Reply-To: <9739.9404271348@pasta.st-andrews.ac.uk> from "Colin G Piggot" at Apr 27, 94 03:48:08 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21]
Content-Type: text
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 654
Lines: 14

> > Now, I would stil like to support the SAM, but the question is: Do
> > I fork out 110 quid for Legend of Ashran, Driver, SAMPaint, Lemmings
> > and a new ASIC? Now, I can even pay in Norwegian bank-notes. :)
> 
> Why would you want to buy a new ASIC - there is only one version
> of it?

I do - when the one I have is broken. :)

-- 
* Frode Tennebo                        * It's better to live life in     *
* email: frodet@ulke.dhmolde.no        * wealth and die poor, than live  * 
*        Frode.Tennebo@dhmolde.no      * life in poverty and die rich.   *
* snail: Parkv. 31, 6400 Molde, NORWAY *                   -Frode Tennebo*

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Wed Apr 27 17:50:31 1994
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
From: Simon Cooke <CSL@fs2.electrical-engineering.umist.ac.uk>
Date: 27 Apr 94 17:02:08 GMT
Subject: Re: The MiDGET
Priority: normal
X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail v2.3 (R4).
Message-Id: <67D2E4605B5@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk>
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 1884
Lines: 50

> ] What does what tell you? OK, so we've been rattling off quite a few messages
> ] over the past two days - I think Simon and I tend to be logged on at much the
> ] same times as each other.
>
> But was anyone else reading them? I didn't see them... oh well.
>
> Oh yeah, and Simon is refusing to answer my mail. *sigh*

No I'm not!!! Have you got the right address??????

I haven't received any -- honest.

> ] > As to display chips... I think the chip you were using was actually used
> ] > in the first Archimedes... don't quote me on that though...
> ]
> ] Well, well, well. What are the graphics capabilities of the Arc like? I know
> ] that the machine is a bit nippy when it comes to number crunching, but I never
> ] really saw anything graphical.
>
> The words `very very nice' spring to mind...
>
> Especially the latest set, which have little to do with that chip. Was it the
> Hitachi one?

BTW: the Arc's graphics stuff are built into the ARM chip that they
use...

Just thought you might like to know.. I think the sound is too.

> Oh yeah, talking of the Arch... if anyone owns one, read the various reviews
> of KV in last months (April's) mags -- the bits about the music and sound.
> Not a lot of people know this, but I co-wrote the music...
>
> `The sound is the best feature of this game'
> `Buy it'
> -- Acorn User

Cooo!!! Fancy bringing a tape of it to the show so that I can listen
to it on my walkman, Geoff?

> <<< is *well* chuffed.
>
> Geoff               (gaw-a@minster.york.ac.uk / gaw2@york.ac.uk -- INET)

Si

+------------------INTERNET: CSL@FS2.EE.UMIST.AC.UK-------------------+
| "You know... you can tell someone's vain when they quote themselves |
|           in their own .sig file..." -- Simon Cooke                 |
+--------------------JANET: CSL@UK.AC.UMIST.EE.FS2--------------------+

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Wed Apr 27 17:50:55 1994
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
From: Simon Cooke <CSL@fs2.electrical-engineering.umist.ac.uk>
Date: 27 Apr 94 16:56:48 GMT
Subject: Re: BBB ?
Priority: normal
X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail v2.3 (R4).
Message-Id: <67D17B036F3@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk>
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 2241
Lines: 45

> Some questions have been raised in this forum about how 'Big Bad
Bob' has
> been handeling the affairs of Revelation and West Coast Computers. Now,
> I have been waiting for a certain fax from him for two months or so, and
> guess what - I got it the other day :)

*grins* well... it's beyond a joke when they say that they send disks
for testing by Format Publications, and then send their replies
(after the discs have "come back") from Gloucester, which is nowhere
near their supposed base in Essex.

> First of all, it has never been a secret that Format is handeling the
> shipping of the goods for Revelation and WCC, and that Blue Alpha
> is handeling assembly/repairs. In his fax, Bob mentiones that BA has
> been on the move for some time, but has now settled down again, and
> claims this to be the reason for the recent fuck-up (not his exact
> words, though....). I don't know whether this is true or not, but at
> least I think we can give the man a chance. After all, he has put a lot
> of effort into a, though great computer, commercial failure.

No -- It was (and don't publish this anywhere but here) Bob not
paying Adrian Parker for services rendered. That's what's been
holding up a lot of stuff.

> Now, I would stil like to support the SAM, but the question is: Do
> I fork out 110 quid for Legend of Ashran, Driver, SAMPaint, Lemmings
> and a new ASIC? Now, I can even pay in Norwegian bank-notes. :)

*laughs* I don't want ***ANYONE*** to buy driver before it's
upgraded. You have been warned. I can't get in touch with Steve
Taylor -- he didn't give me his email address.

> Apropos ASIC; some rumours have been floating around that the stock
> of ASICs are empty. This is not true according to Bob, more than 6000
> are in store.

No doubt about that -- question is, whose store? They're all sitting
in VLSI's warehouses waiting to be bought up. Still not *paid* for,
y'see.

Si
+------------------INTERNET: CSL@FS2.EE.UMIST.AC.UK-------------------+
| "You know... you can tell someone's vain when they quote themselves |
|           in their own .sig file..." -- Simon Cooke                 |
+--------------------JANET: CSL@UK.AC.UMIST.EE.FS2--------------------+

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Wed Apr 27 17:51:01 1994
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
From: Simon Cooke <CSL@fs2.electrical-engineering.umist.ac.uk>
Date: 27 Apr 94 17:00:11 GMT
Subject: Re: The MiDGET
Priority: normal
X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail v2.3 (R4).
Message-Id: <67D25CC05B2@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk>
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 1251
Lines: 29

> Umm... just exactly what does this tell us? The bit at the bottom about
> other people joining in? I never saw any of this before...

*grins* I think our mailers must have not sent to the mailing list
and been sending just back and forth us two :)

Sorry!

> As to display chips... I think the chip you were using was actually used
> in the first Archimedes... don't quote me on that though...

Nope... it's a VGA RAMDAC -- 256 colour clut, 6 bit RGB. (something
like a quarter of a million colours)

And besides... we're building one out of DAC's now (due to it
blowing) and it's gonna be a 2048 colour clut, 256 per line,
selectable each screen line using a special 2k ram selector that
switches modes etc, per screen line. Oh yes, and 24 bit. This is the
version you'll be seeing at the show now.

> Geoff               (gaw-a@minster.york.ac.uk / gaw2@york.ac.uk --
INET)

Si "Doesn't give a fig about having long sigs" Cooke

+------------------INTERNET: CSL@FS2.EE.UMIST.AC.UK-------------------+
| "You know... you can tell someone's vain when they quote themselves |
|           in their own .sig file..." -- Simon Cooke                 |
+--------------------JANET: CSL@UK.AC.UMIST.EE.FS2--------------------+

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Wed Apr 27 17:55:30 1994
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
From: Simon Cooke <CSL@fs2.electrical-engineering.umist.ac.uk>
Date: 27 Apr 94 17:10:08 GMT
Subject: Cookie's novels: 2nd novel, 1st page only. Title: Vampyre Dawn.
Priority: normal
X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail v2.3 (R4).
Message-Id: <67D505E2F2E@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk>
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 3477
Lines: 64

                                   Vampyre Dawn

                               (c) 1994 Simon Cooke

             For Debby, Marc, Laura, Mikey, Simon, Adam, Rob, Lauren,
               Louisa, Dave, Neil and the rest of the Vampire pack.

             Thanks to Neil Rooke for allowing me to use the character
                                     of Mace.

                                      * * *

                  The last embers  of the fire  flickered out, the red
             and yellow  flames being replaced  by a dull  red glow, a
             poor substitute  for their  heat and  light. Overhead the
             sky was jewelled  with the stars of  a tropical night and
             on the  horizon the very  first gentle light  of dawn was
             creeping  up, spreading  its  fingers  slowly  across the
             land.
                  By the  fireside two  men talked,  one in  his early
             thirties, the other  possibly younger but  with a look in
             his  eyes  that  showed  he  had  lived  longer  than his
             features could ever reveal.
                  Eventually after  much  discussion they  came  to an
             uneasy agreement and then shook hands.
                  The sounds of the  insects  that had previously been
             buzzing around  the  camp fire  ceased,  almost as  if in
             apprehension of  what  was to  follow.  Silence descended
             over the camp like a dark cloak.
                  Without looking, the older of the men pointed across
             the exhausted fire to a  crib that was perched on a rock.
             The other got up and  walked silently over to it. The man
             remaining by the fire looked down at his hands, seemingly
             questioning his actions.
                  The man by the crib bent down and looked inside, his
             change  of posture  allowing  him  to see  the  young boy
             within.
                  With a swift motion he  took a blade from the sheath
             on his  belt and  jabbed it  into his  left forefinger. A
             small droplet  of blood oozed  out of  the puncture hole,
             crimson red on pale white. He put the knife back onto his
             belt.
                  Reaching into  the crib,  the man  delicately opened
             the  sleeping infant's  mouth  with  his  right  hand. He
             slowly  inserted  his  bleeding  forefinger  between  the
             child's lips and stroked it  in a slow gentle motion down
             the child's tongue. The  blood spread across its surface,
             seeping into every pore.
                  Satisfied that he had finished his work, the man got
             up and walked  away from the camp  into the early morning
             light.

                  The infant awoke with a loud scream, and by the fire
             the man  who  remained cried  at what  he had  allowed to
             happen.


And there you have it :)
Comments would be appreciated. And I'm not promising that I'll let
you know what happens next ! :) :) :)
+------------------INTERNET: CSL@FS2.EE.UMIST.AC.UK-------------------+
| "You know... you can tell someone's vain when they quote themselves |
|           in their own .sig file..." -- Simon Cooke                 |
+--------------------JANET: CSL@UK.AC.UMIST.EE.FS2--------------------+

From imc Wed Apr 27 18:09:22 1994
Subject: Re: Cookie's novels: 2nd novel, 1st page only. Title: Vampyre Dawn.
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Wed, 27 Apr 94 18:09:22 BST
In-Reply-To: <67D505E2F2E@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk>; from "Simon Cooke" at Apr 27, 94 5:10 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]
Content-Length: 2249
Lines: 45

On 27 Apr 94 17:10:08 GMT, Simon Cooke said:
>                                    Vampyre Dawn

>                                (c) 1994 Simon Cooke

[snip]

> And there you have it :)

So I do.

> Comments would be appreciated.

My comment: right-justified text on monospaced devices is anathema to
typesetting purists.  (Unless you do it without adding spaces, that is.
I've done that before now...)

What, you didn't expect me to *read* it, did you?  Why would I want to do
that?...   :-)

imc

The blood spreading  its finger to it.   The men talked down  at his feature
allow flames  belt and on  pale white.  He sleeping  replaced by a  dull red
over the sounds of  the man got up and walked, almost  as if in apprehension
his actions.   The man who  remained crimson  remaining up, spread  the crib
bent and walked, almost as if in  his left forefinger.  A small droplet of a
tropical night.  The  infant's mouth with a loud scream,  and walked it into
the had  light hands, see  the camp  fire look in  a rock.  The  blood oozed
on a  swift motions.   The sheat and  the crib, the  fire ceased,  almost as
if in  a rock.  The in  his hand.  He sleeping  around the older of  the sky
was creeping infant's  mouth with a loud scream, and  longer between buzzing
infant's mouth a  rock.  Without with a  dark cloak.  With a  swift mout the
camp  insion red  across tooked  the happread  ands, spread  light his  eyes
could eveal.   Eventuallow flickered over  the exhausted out of  the child's
mouth that  and jabbed crib  bent down who rever  bentle white.  He  shook a
troplet of their  he man replace, see  the fire ceasy actions.   The man red
withouth a  swift motions.  The  man down and the  fire horizon and  was the
remained was the young it.  Reachild's lips and lood on reveal.  Everhe ment
ars hilefireminge  follefir oping  red ing  but of ing  ing hat  mot ungento
muchis the  by oper  by poss  buzzinfand on out  a lowit  his on  by ingerch
the of ithater gothe cam, chappenctualked the of bented but ong a scussild's
eved, to fintell night.  He lowly yout  an the to he cribly thooke fies sman
thappre in  aft ithe  lown drople,  acriblong he  for theyellouthed  on poss
oustrock.

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Wed Apr 27 19:19:02 1994
From: frodet@ulke.dhmolde.no (Frode Tennebo)
Message-Id: <9404271817.AA28375@ulke.dhmolde.no>
Subject: Re: BBB ?
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Wed, 27 Apr 1994 20:17:56 +0200 (MET DST)
In-Reply-To: <67D17B036F3@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk> from "Simon Cooke" at Apr 27, 94 04:56:48 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21]
Content-Type: text
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 2191
Lines: 45

> > Some questions have been raised in this forum about how 'Big Bad
> Bob' has
> > been handeling the affairs of Revelation and West Coast Computers. Now,
> > I have been waiting for a certain fax from him for two months or so, and
> > guess what - I got it the other day :)
> 
> *grins* well... it's beyond a joke when they say that they send disks
> for testing by Format Publications, and then send their replies
> (after the discs have "come back") from Gloucester, which is nowhere
> near their supposed base in Essex.

Perhpas the in-house disk-tester is located in Gloucester? :)

> > First of all, it has never been a secret that Format is handeling the
> > shipping of the goods for Revelation and WCC, and that Blue Alpha
> > is handeling assembly/repairs. In his fax, Bob mentiones that BA has
> > been on the move for some time, but has now settled down again, and
> > claims this to be the reason for the recent fuck-up (not his exact
> > words, though....). I don't know whether this is true or not, but at
> > least I think we can give the man a chance. After all, he has put a lot
> > of effort into a, though great computer, commercial failure.
> 
> No -- It was (and don't publish this anywhere but here) Bob not
> paying Adrian Parker for services rendered. That's what's been
> holding up a lot of stuff.

Yeah! Hope that's settled now.

> 
> > Now, I would stil like to support the SAM, but the question is: Do
> > I fork out 110 quid for Legend of Ashran, Driver, SAMPaint, Lemmings
> > and a new ASIC? Now, I can even pay in Norwegian bank-notes. :)
> 
> *laughs* I don't want ***ANYONE*** to buy driver before it's
> upgraded. You have been warned. I can't get in touch with Steve
> Taylor -- he didn't give me his email address.

Will he upgrade before enough copies have been sold? What's so
very wrong with it?

-- 
* Frode Tennebo                        * It's better to live life in     *
* email: frodet@ulke.dhmolde.no        * wealth and die poor, than live  * 
*        Frode.Tennebo@dhmolde.no      * life in poverty and die rich.   *
* snail: Parkv. 31, 6400 Molde, NORWAY *                   -Frode Tennebo*

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Wed Apr 27 19:24:39 1994
From: frodet@ulke.dhmolde.no (Frode Tennebo)
Message-Id: <9404271823.AA28418@ulke.dhmolde.no>
Subject: Re: BBB ?
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Wed, 27 Apr 1994 20:23:44 +0200 (MET DST)
In-Reply-To: <14910.199404271252@stone> from "Nigel J Kettlewell" at Apr 27, 94 01:52:27 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21]
Content-Type: text
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 1440
Lines: 25

> > Some questions have been raised in this forum about how 'Big Bad Bob' has
> > been handeling the affairs of Revelation and West Coast Computers.
> > 
> > First of all, it has never been a secret that Format is handeling the
> > shipping of the goods for Revelation and WCC, and that Blue Alpha
> > is handeling assembly/repairs. In his fax, Bob mentiones that BA has
> > been on the move for some time, but has now settled down again, and
> > claims this to be the reason for the recent fuck-up (not his exact
> > words, though....). I don't know whether this is true or not, but at
> > least I think we can give the man a chance. After all, he has put a lot
> > of effort into a, though great computer, commercial failure.
> 
> That was exactly the way I felt until he started messing me about. You say
> that he's put a lot of effort into the SAM. Well, I'm not so sure - what
> has he achieved exactly?

He took over when MGT and SAMCo went down. I have no first-hand
knowledge of what is going on, but it would be a shame if he had to
close down business. Is there anybody else willing to take over?

-- 
* Frode Tennebo                        * It's better to live life in     *
* email: frodet@ulke.dhmolde.no        * wealth and die poor, than live  * 
*        Frode.Tennebo@dhmolde.no      * life in poverty and die rich.   *
* snail: Parkv. 31, 6400 Molde, NORWAY *                   -Frode Tennebo*

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Wed Apr 27 20:34:50 1994
From: Nigel J Kettlewell <N.J.Kettlewell@dcs.warwick.ac.uk>
Message-Id: <29388.199404271933@stone>
Subject: Re: The MiDGET (fwd)
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no (SAM Mailing list)
Date: Wed, 27 Apr 1994 20:33:19 +0100 (BST)
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL20]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 2840
Lines: 75

This is actually from Simon originally, so anybody trying to work out the
quotations should have fun...

Forwarded message:
> From sendmail Wed Apr 27 17:51:56 1994
> Via: uk.ac.umist.central-services.sun; Wed, 27 Apr 1994 17:51:02 +0100
> To: Nigel J Kettlewell <N.J.Kettlewell@dcs.warwick.ac.uk>
> From: Simon Cooke <CSL@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk>
> Date: 27 Apr 94 17:07:52 GMT
> Subject: Re: The MiDGET
> Priority: normal
> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail v2.3 (R4).
> Message-ID: <67D471B3592@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk>
> 
> > Is it my mail system going mad, or was this one posted twice?
> 
> I emailed it both to you and SAM-USERS, just in case... seems I was
> right about the "just in case".
> 
> > Yep, I can convert JPEGs as easily as anything else. If using the PC's is OK,
> > then not to worry.
> 
> Goodie!
> 
> > > Mmmm... still doesn't explain the slowness of the SAM.
> > >
> >
> > Inherent lack of processor speed? Don't know, really. Graphic format
> > conversions _always_ seem to be slow, no matter what the machine.
> 
> Yeah... btw: after the show, full steam ahead is going on the 20MHz
> Accelerator board... coming soon :) :) :)
> 
> It may have space on the board for a possible MULTIFACE like hoofer-
> doofer... depends -- we'll see, anyway.
> 
> > > BTW: Poetry 'cos I'm writing a novel... 80 pages and still going
> > > strong :)
> >
> > What's it about?
> 
> This one's about time travel... the next one's about vampires... one
> after that is alien abductions -- and after that, probably a thriller
> thingy to do with the net. I *had* planned it to be a Deus Ex Machina
> thing, but I decided that the plot I'd come up with was too week --
> so net thriller it now is.
> 
> I'll mail the first page of both to the net today -- see whatcha think
> 
> (oops.. only the vampire first page. Oh well).
> 
> > > DAMN! They didn't have any!!! So now I've got 2x8bit DACs, and we
> > > have to build the blue one out of resistors :( :( :(
> > >
> >
> > Yuk. At least you're not having to build an ADC from individual components.
> > Tried the Yellow Pages for other electronics shops? There's one round the
> > corner from me when I'm at home in Bournemouth, which is very handy.
> 
> Not enough time... Oh well :(
> 
> Besides, the blue one doesn't need startling monotonicity or
> anything, so we can make do with resistors...
> 
> Again, apologies for people who've just joined us... I'll mail an
> article about the MiDGET tomorrow night.
> 
> Si Cooke
> 
> +------------------INTERNET: CSL@FS2.EE.UMIST.AC.UK-------------------+
> | "You know... you can tell someone's vain when they quote themselves |
> |           in their own .sig file..." -- Simon Cooke                 |
> +--------------------JANET: CSL@UK.AC.UMIST.EE.FS2--------------------+
> 


From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Wed Apr 27 20:47:54 1994
From: Nigel J Kettlewell <N.J.Kettlewell@dcs.warwick.ac.uk>
Message-Id: <672.199404271947@stone>
Subject: Re: The MiDGET
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Wed, 27 Apr 1994 20:47:03 +0100 (BST)
In-Reply-To: <9404271512.AA08847@booth3.ecs.ox.ac.uk> from "Ian.Collier@comlab.ox.ac.uk" at Apr 27, 94 17:12:36 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL20]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 473
Lines: 19

> 
> On Wed, 27 Apr 1994 15:25:19 +0100, Geoff Winkless said:
> 
> > What's the betting they've been using reply-to-all instead of just
> > reply-to-sender...

I just hit 'R' to reply, and the message gets sent to everybody as far as
I know - after all, they got sent not only to Simon but also to _me_ so they
must have got as far as the mailing list database...

Anyhow, apologies to anybody who wanted to join in but couldn't...

> 
> imc
> 

Nige



From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Thu Apr 28 10:46:59 1994
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
From: Simon Cooke <CSL@fs2.electrical-engineering.umist.ac.uk>
Date: 28 Apr 94 10:01:02 GMT
Subject: Re: Cookie's novels: 2nd novel, 1st page only. Title: Vampy
Priority: normal
X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail v2.3 (R4).
Message-Id: <68E2A0120DE@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk>
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 795
Lines: 26

> >                                    Vampyre Dawn
> [snip]
>
> > And there you have it :)
>
> So I do.
>
> > Comments would be appreciated.
>
> My comment: right-justified text on monospaced devices is anathema to
> typesetting purists.  (Unless you do it without adding spaces, that is.
> I've done that before now...)
>
> What, you didn't expect me to *read* it, did you?  Why would I want to do
> that?...   :-)
>
> imc

Laughs... ah! I see you babbled it instead... !!

Si

+------------------INTERNET: CSL@FS2.EE.UMIST.AC.UK-------------------+
| "You know... you can tell someone's vain when they quote themselves |
|           in their own .sig file..." -- Simon Cooke                 |
+--------------------JANET: CSL@UK.AC.UMIST.EE.FS2--------------------+

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Thu Apr 28 10:57:38 1994
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
From: Simon Cooke <CSL@fs2.electrical-engineering.umist.ac.uk>
Date: 28 Apr 94 10:05:31 GMT
Subject: Re: BBB ?
Priority: normal
X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail v2.3 (R4).
Message-Id: <68E3D324E51@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk>
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 2596
Lines: 55

> > *grins* well... it's beyond a joke when they say that they send disks
> > for testing by Format Publications, and then send their replies
> > (after the discs have "come back") from Gloucester, which is nowhere
> > near their supposed base in Essex.
>
> Perhpas the in-house disk-tester is located in Gloucester? :)

Let's put it this way -- BOB is now claiming (May issue of FORMAT)
that he sent the disc back to Nigel ALL 3 TIMES and the second time
he sent a different disc. He also seems to have no idea whatsoever
about statutory consumer rights -- which is something I'll have a
look at from a legal angle soon to sort him out. If he's selling
damaged or bugged goods, people shouldn't have to send a "customary"
SAE as he puts it in order to get them fixed -- he sells them in that
state, he should foot the bill. Nuff said.

> > No -- It was (and don't publish this anywhere but here) Bob not
> > paying Adrian Parker for services rendered. That's what's been
> > holding up a lot of stuff.
>
> Yeah! Hope that's settled now.

Erm.. possibly. We're working on hardware with him on our own -- the
Hard Drive, Accelerator, Graphics board, new SAM-OmniBus, SAM
Multiface add-on for the accelerator and lots more are
Entropy/Rooksoft/Blue Alpha developments -- Entropy and Rooksoft
inventing them, Blue Alpha mass producing them. Apart from the hard-
drive that is -- Entropy's just designing and coding the BIOS ROM for
it. Oh, and the DOS.

BTW: For entropy, should that read "Simon Cooke?" Possibly. I do too
much that I could farm out to other people :)

> > > Now, I would stil like to support the SAM, but the question is: Do
> > > I fork out 110 quid for Legend of Ashran, Driver, SAMPaint, Lemmings
> > > and a new ASIC? Now, I can even pay in Norwegian bank-notes. :)
> >
> > *laughs* I don't want ***ANYONE*** to buy driver before it's
> > upgraded. You have been warned. I can't get in touch with Steve
> > Taylor -- he didn't give me his email address.
>
> Will he upgrade before enough copies have been sold? What's so
> very wrong with it?

Erm.... well, it's got loadsa bugs, no documentation of a technical
nature, and the wordprocessor is*SERIOUSLY* bugged.

Si

ps I'll post up my letters/correspondance when I get the time.

+------------------INTERNET: CSL@FS2.EE.UMIST.AC.UK-------------------+
| "You know... you can tell someone's vain when they quote themselves |
|           in their own .sig file..." -- Simon Cooke                 |
+--------------------JANET: CSL@UK.AC.UMIST.EE.FS2--------------------+

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Thu Apr 28 10:57:43 1994
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
From: Simon Cooke <CSL@fs2.electrical-engineering.umist.ac.uk>
Date: 28 Apr 94 10:06:49 GMT
Subject: Re: BBB ?
Priority: normal
X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail v2.3 (R4).
Message-Id: <68E42D84F9E@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk>
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 1023
Lines: 23

> > That was exactly the way I felt until he started messing me about. You say
> > that he's put a lot of effort into the SAM. Well, I'm not so sure - what
> > has he achieved exactly?
>
> He took over when MGT and SAMCo went down. I have no first-hand
> knowledge of what is going on, but it would be a shame if he had to
> close down business. Is there anybody else willing to take over?

It *is* rumoured that the reason that West Coast took so long to get
the rights to the SAM (which they still might not have full rights
too -- watch out for the SAM-in-a-PC-case-with-meaty-PSU from
ENTROPY) is because Alan & Bruce and the receivers didn't want Bob to
get the machine. Note that's only a rumour.

Si




+------------------INTERNET: CSL@FS2.EE.UMIST.AC.UK-------------------+
| "You know... you can tell someone's vain when they quote themselves |
|           in their own .sig file..." -- Simon Cooke                 |
+--------------------JANET: CSL@UK.AC.UMIST.EE.FS2--------------------+

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Thu Apr 28 15:17:38 1994
From: Nigel J Kettlewell <N.J.Kettlewell@dcs.warwick.ac.uk>
Message-Id: <8261.199404281344@stone>
Subject: Re: BBB ?
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Thu, 28 Apr 1994 14:44:31 +0100 (BST)
In-Reply-To: <68E3D324E51@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk> from "Simon Cooke" at Apr 28, 94 10:05:31 am
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL20]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 1035
Lines: 26

> 
> > > *grins* well... it's beyond a joke when they say that they send disks
> > > for testing by Format Publications, and then send their replies
> > > (after the discs have "come back") from Gloucester, which is nowhere
> > > near their supposed base in Essex.
> >
> > Perhpas the in-house disk-tester is located in Gloucester? :)
> 
> Let's put it this way -- BOB is now claiming (May issue of FORMAT)
> that he sent the disc back to Nigel ALL 3 TIMES and the second time

He's claiming that in Format? I haven't got the May issue yet - I expect
it'll be forwarded to me in a couple of days.

> he sent a different disc. He also seems to have no idea whatsoever
> about statutory consumer rights -- which is something I'll have a
> look at from a legal angle soon to sort him out. If he's selling
> damaged or bugged goods, people shouldn't have to send a "customary"
> SAE as he puts it in order to get them fixed -- he sells them in that
> state, he should foot the bill. Nuff said.
> 
> Si
> 

Nige


From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Thu Apr 28 18:54:38 1994
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
From: Simon Cooke <CSL@fs2.electrical-engineering.umist.ac.uk>
Date: 28 Apr 94 16:43:13 GMT
Subject: Re: BBB ?
Priority: normal
X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail v2.3 (R4).
Message-Id: <694DE492481@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk>
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 1668
Lines: 32

> > It *is* rumoured that the reason that West Coast took so long to get
> > the rights to the SAM (which they still might not have full rights
> > too -- watch out for the SAM-in-a-PC-case-with-meaty-PSU from
> > ENTROPY) is because Alan & Bruce and the receivers didn't want Bob to
> > get the machine. Note that's only a rumour.
>
> Well, a rumour from you is like solid facts from The Pope :)
> Unquestionable ;)

Welll....... I do get my info from lots of sources across the world,
but keep it under your collective hats..

> But the question is, were there anybody else than Bob that wanted
> the machine? I would more than anything see that Alan & Bruce could
> continue. but I understand that they were not allowed to run any
> business for some time?

Yeah... also, Alan decided that he'd had enough of losing his house
every time something went bad, and went back to Saudi Arabia to
teach. Bruce, however, having set up SAMTech, which was being run by
him separately from SAMCo (namely *just in case* anything unthinkable
like SAMCo going down happened), could still do it. It's just that he
won't touch the SAM with a bargepole when he can be making much more
money elsewhere. Of course, he still offers consultancy thingybobs to
his friends who are designing stuff -- and he loved the elegance of
design of /My/ accelerator board!

Si
+------------------INTERNET: CSL@FS2.EE.UMIST.AC.UK-------------------+
| "You know... you can tell someone's vain when they quote themselves |
|           in their own .sig file..." -- Simon Cooke                 |
+--------------------JANET: CSL@UK.AC.UMIST.EE.FS2--------------------+

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Thu Apr 28 19:37:04 1994
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
From: Simon Cooke <CSL@fs2.electrical-engineering.umist.ac.uk>
Date: 28 Apr 94 14:46:51 GMT
Subject: Re: BBB ?
Priority: normal
X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail v2.3 (R4).
Message-Id: <692EDD96AA9@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk>
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 1012
Lines: 20

> > Let's put it this way -- BOB is now claiming (May issue of FORMAT)
> > that he sent the disc back to Nigel ALL 3 TIMES and the second time
>
> He's claiming that in Format? I haven't got the May issue yet - I expect
> it'll be forwarded to me in a couple of days.

Yep, he's claiming that.

> > he sent a different disc. He also seems to have no idea whatsoever
> > about statutory consumer rights -- which is something I'll have a
> > look at from a legal angle soon to sort him out. If he's selling
> > damaged or bugged goods, people shouldn't have to send a "customary"
> > SAE as he puts it in order to get them fixed -- he sells them in that
> > state, he should foot the bill. Nuff said.

Si
+------------------INTERNET: CSL@FS2.EE.UMIST.AC.UK-------------------+
| "You know... you can tell someone's vain when they quote themselves |
|           in their own .sig file..." -- Simon Cooke                 |
+--------------------JANET: CSL@UK.AC.UMIST.EE.FS2--------------------+

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Thu Apr 28 19:40:07 1994
From: frodet@ulke.dhmolde.no (Frode Tennebo)
Message-Id: <9404281837.AA05465@ulke.dhmolde.no>
Subject: Re: BBB ?
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Thu, 28 Apr 1994 20:37:18 +0200 (MET DST)
In-Reply-To: <694DE492481@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk> from "Simon Cooke" at Apr 28, 94 04:43:13 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21]
Content-Type: text
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 1649
Lines: 34

> > Well, a rumour from you is like solid facts from The Pope :)
> > Unquestionable ;)
> 
> Welll....... I do get my info from lots of sources across the world,
> but keep it under your collective hats..

10-4!

> > But the question is, were there anybody else than Bob that wanted
> > the machine? I would more than anything see that Alan & Bruce could
> > continue. but I understand that they were not allowed to run any
> > business for some time?
> 
> Yeah... also, Alan decided that he'd had enough of losing his house
> every time something went bad, and went back to Saudi Arabia to
> teach. Bruce, however, having set up SAMTech, which was being run by
> him separately from SAMCo (namely *just in case* anything unthinkable
> like SAMCo going down happened), could still do it. It's just that he
> won't touch the SAM with a bargepole when he can be making much more
> money elsewhere. Of course, he still offers consultancy thingybobs to
> his friends who are designing stuff -- and he loved the elegance of
> design of /My/ accelerator board!

Yeah! I am still wondering WHAT's so elegant about it :) I guess if
I keep these postings coming, I'll never know. :)

What about persuading him to adapt your *elegant* accelrator into
a dream-computer, with pipelining and co-prosessors for EVERYTHING?

-- 
* Frode Tennebo                        * It's better to live life in     *
* email: frodet@ulke.dhmolde.no        * wealth and die poor, than live  * 
*        Frode.Tennebo@dhmolde.no      * life in poverty and die rich.   *
* snail: Parkv. 31, 6400 Molde, NORWAY *                   -Frode Tennebo*

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Thu Apr 28 19:50:08 1994
From: frodet@ulke.dhmolde.no (Frode Tennebo)
Message-Id: <9404281614.AA04732@ulke.dhmolde.no>
Subject: Re: BBB ?
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Thu, 28 Apr 1994 18:14:43 +0200 (MET DST)
In-Reply-To: <68E42D84F9E@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk> from "Simon Cooke" at Apr 28, 94 10:06:49 am
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21]
Content-Type: text
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 1372
Lines: 28

> 
> > > That was exactly the way I felt until he started messing me about. You say
> > > that he's put a lot of effort into the SAM. Well, I'm not so sure - what
> > > has he achieved exactly?
> >
> > He took over when MGT and SAMCo went down. I have no first-hand
> > knowledge of what is going on, but it would be a shame if he had to
> > close down business. Is there anybody else willing to take over?
> 
> It *is* rumoured that the reason that West Coast took so long to get
> the rights to the SAM (which they still might not have full rights
> too -- watch out for the SAM-in-a-PC-case-with-meaty-PSU from
> ENTROPY) is because Alan & Bruce and the receivers didn't want Bob to
> get the machine. Note that's only a rumour.

Well, a rumour from you is like solid facts from The Pope :)
Unquestionable ;)

But the question is, were there anybody else than Bob that wanted
the machine? I would more than anything see that Alan & Bruce could
continue. but I understand that they were not allowed to run any
business for some time?
 
-- 
* Frode Tennebo                        * It's better to live life in     *
* email: frodet@ulke.dhmolde.no        * wealth and die poor, than live  * 
*        Frode.Tennebo@dhmolde.no      * life in poverty and die rich.   *
* snail: Parkv. 31, 6400 Molde, NORWAY *                   -Frode Tennebo*

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Fri Apr 29 10:36:38 1994
From: Nigel J Kettlewell <N.J.Kettlewell@dcs.warwick.ac.uk>
Message-Id: <27984.199404290932@stone>
Subject: Re: BBB ?
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Fri, 29 Apr 1994 10:32:47 +0100 (BST)
In-Reply-To: <692EDD96AA9@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk> from "Simon Cooke" at Apr 28, 94 14:46:51 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL20]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 601
Lines: 21

> 
> > > Let's put it this way -- BOB is now claiming (May issue of FORMAT)
> > > that he sent the disc back to Nigel ALL 3 TIMES and the second time
> >
> > He's claiming that in Format? I haven't got the May issue yet - I expect
> > it'll be forwarded to me in a couple of days.
> 
> Yep, he's claiming that.

Oh dear Bob. Still no sign of Format, tho no doubt they'll have some at the
show. Now that he's _published_ a complete lie, this is _much_ worse than it
was before, as he's doing me down in print, by the sound of it.

> 
> > > he sent a different disc.
> Si


Nige



From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Fri Apr 29 10:44:15 1994
From: Nigel J Kettlewell <N.J.Kettlewell@dcs.warwick.ac.uk>
Message-Id: <28844.199404290941@stone>
Subject: Re: BBB ?
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Fri, 29 Apr 1994 10:41:39 +0100 (BST)
In-Reply-To: <9404281614.AA04732@ulke.dhmolde.no> from "Frode Tennebo" at Apr 28, 94 18:14:43 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL20]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 720
Lines: 20

> > It *is* rumoured that the reason that West Coast took so long to get
> > the rights to the SAM (which they still might not have full rights
> > too -- watch out for the SAM-in-a-PC-case-with-meaty-PSU from
> > ENTROPY) is because Alan & Bruce and the receivers didn't want Bob to
> > get the machine. Note that's only a rumour.
> 
> Well, a rumour from you is like solid facts from The Pope :)
> Unquestionable ;)
> 
> But the question is, were there anybody else than Bob that wanted
> the machine? I would more than anything see that Alan & Bruce could
> continue. but I understand that they were not allowed to run any
> business for some time?

Because they still owe money? Simon?

Nige




From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Fri Apr 29 11:14:11 1994
From: Nigel J Kettlewell <N.J.Kettlewell@dcs.warwick.ac.uk>
Message-Id: <2446.199404291013@stone>
Subject: Gloucester show
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no (SAM Mailing list)
Date: Fri, 29 Apr 1994 11:13:02 +0100 (BST)
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL20]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 1706
Lines: 39

It might be a bit late, but Bob's instructions for getting to the show
tomorrow are as follows:

Quedgeley Village Hall
Bristol Road
Quedgeley
Gloucester

"If you are travelling north on the M5 then take exit 12 and follow signs
for Gloucester. A short distance after leaving the m/way you come to a
roundabout from which you take the 2nd exit (A38 towards Gloucester). Now
take the first left onto the B4008 which is sign-posted Quedgeley and Severn
Vale Shopping Centre. Go straight over at the next roundabout. The hall is
then on the left, just before you reach another roundabout. There is a large
free car park as part of the Severn Vale (Tesco) shopping complex just round
the corner.

For those of you coming south on the M5 there are two choices. Either exit
at junction 13 and turn north onto the A38 - this only adds about 5 miles to
the journey and avoids the traffic around Gloucester. The alternative is to
exit at junction 11 (the A40 exit) and follow signs for Gloucester, follow
the ring-road around - you eventually get signs for M5 South and Quedgeley.
Finally you come to a roundabout with the local BT offics on the left,
follow signs for Severn Vale Shopping Centre, and see above for more details.

By rail or coach: Both the railway and coach stations are in the centre of
Gloucester - almost next to each other. Buses run from the coach station to
Quedgeley every 15 minutes (about a 10 minute journey). Ask the driver for
Tesco's, he will know where you need to get off"

Phew.

Now I've just got to suss out how to get there by train in the first place.

Apologies for the late posting - I kept forgetting to bring Format with me.

Nige



From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Fri Apr 29 11:19:46 1994
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
From: Simon Cooke <CSL@fs2.electrical-engineering.umist.ac.uk>
Date: 29 Apr 94 10:21:44 GMT
Subject: Re: BBB ?
Priority: normal
X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail v2.3 (R4).
Message-Id: <6A6832C2D47@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk>
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 1036
Lines: 22

> > > > Let's put it this way -- BOB is now claiming (May issue of FORMAT)
> > > > that he sent the disc back to Nigel ALL 3 TIMES and the second time
> > >
> > > He's claiming that in Format? I haven't got the May issue yet - I expect
> > > it'll be forwarded to me in a couple of days.
> >
> > Yep, he's claiming that.
>
> Oh dear Bob. Still no sign of Format, tho no doubt they'll have some at the
> show. Now that he's _published_ a complete lie, this is _much_ worse than it
> was before, as he's doing me down in print, by the sound of it.

*grins* in a moment I'm off to a library to find some law books and
photocopy the statutory consumer rights bill..

That should show him where to shove his stipulatory SAE's

Si
+------------------INTERNET: CSL@FS2.EE.UMIST.AC.UK-------------------+
| "You know... you can tell someone's vain when they quote themselves |
|           in their own .sig file..." -- Simon Cooke                 |
+--------------------JANET: CSL@UK.AC.UMIST.EE.FS2--------------------+

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Fri Apr 29 11:20:07 1994
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
From: Simon Cooke <CSL@fs2.electrical-engineering.umist.ac.uk>
Date: 29 Apr 94 10:20:52 GMT
Subject: Re: BBB ?
Priority: normal
X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail v2.3 (R4).
Message-Id: <6A67F9D7AF9@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk>
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 745
Lines: 18

> > But the question is, were there anybody else than Bob that wanted
> > the machine? I would more than anything see that Alan & Bruce could
> > continue. but I understand that they were not allowed to run any
> > business for some time?
>
> Because they still owe money? Simon?
>
> Nige

Erm... sort of... let's put it this way, when SAMCo went down, Alan
was legally bankrupt -- and literally too. I think he lost his house
in it.

Si
+------------------INTERNET: CSL@FS2.EE.UMIST.AC.UK-------------------+
| "You know... you can tell someone's vain when they quote themselves |
|           in their own .sig file..." -- Simon Cooke                 |
+--------------------JANET: CSL@UK.AC.UMIST.EE.FS2--------------------+

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Fri Apr 29 11:43:23 1994
From: Nigel J Kettlewell <N.J.Kettlewell@dcs.warwick.ac.uk>
Message-Id: <3830.199404291028@stone>
Subject: Re: BBB ?
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Fri, 29 Apr 1994 11:28:12 +0100 (BST)
In-Reply-To: <6A67F9D7AF9@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk> from "Simon Cooke" at Apr 29, 94 10:20:52 am
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL20]
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Status: RO
Content-Length: 678
Lines: 24

> 
> > > But the question is, were there anybody else than Bob that wanted
> > > the machine? I would more than anything see that Alan & Bruce could
> > > continue. but I understand that they were not allowed to run any
> > > business for some time?
> >
> > Because they still owe money? Simon?
> >
> > Nige
> 
> Erm... sort of... let's put it this way, when SAMCo went down, Alan
> was legally bankrupt -- and literally too. I think he lost his house
> in it.

That's hard on Alan. He could have kept the business separate from his own
finances, I suppose, but maybe he was using his mortgage as security on loans
and what have you...

> 
> Si

Nige



From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Fri Apr 29 11:43:49 1994
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
From: Simon Cooke <CSL@fs2.electrical-engineering.umist.ac.uk>
Date: 29 Apr 94 10:39:55 GMT
Subject: Re: BBB ?
Priority: normal
X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail v2.3 (R4).
Message-Id: <6A6D1235C02@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk>
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 4938
Lines: 109

> > Yeah... also, Alan decided that he'd had enough of losing his house
> > every time something went bad, and went back to Saudi Arabia to
> > teach. Bruce, however, having set up SAMTech, which was being run by
> > him separately from SAMCo (namely *just in case* anything unthinkable
> > like SAMCo going down happened), could still do it. It's just that he
> > won't touch the SAM with a bargepole when he can be making much more
> > money elsewhere. Of course, he still offers consultancy thingybobs to
> > his friends who are designing stuff -- and he loved the elegance of
> > design of /My/ accelerator board!
>
> Yeah! I am still wondering WHAT's so elegant about it :) I guess if
> I keep these postings coming, I'll never know. :)

Ooooh.. well...

Let's put it this way; it uses a 0.5Mb memory mirror with controlled
wait states and read-writes, and has a 20Mhz processor in it.
Basically, the Z84C0020 (20 Mhz z80, now called by me the Z80X), acts
on decision control logic:

If reading from internal RAM, read only from mirror mem, and ignore
ASIC wait signals.
If reading from external RAM, use ASIC WAIT
If reading from ROM, use ASIC WAIT
If writing to RAM and address is in a "mirror bank" (4 banks of 128k
each, selectable), write to both mirror memory and internal memory,
using ASIC Wait signals.
If writing to RAM and address isn't in a mirror bank, write to mirror
memory only, ignore ASIC Waits.
If writing to WPRT memory, ignore ASIC waits, don't write to anything.
If writing to ROM,          ""                  ""
If writing to external RAM, write and use ASIC Wait.

If doing an I/O and control port is set to do so, ASIC WAITs will be
ignored. This is only in as a test feature -- both Bruce and myself
don't know if it'll work if I ignore the WAITs during I/O.

We were thinking of using a FIFO memory so that ports and memory
could be accessed that way, giving even more increased speed, but
decided against it.

Current hardware details:

Memory: 512kb
Processor: Z84C0020
Logic: 3 octal latches *so far*, various gating and switching logic.
Will have a thru' connector, and sockets on the board for an
expansion to turn it into the SAM equivalent of a MultiFACE.

SAMBus will have to be connected *into* the thru'connector. Probably.

Port details:
Port 238 has been decided on for use by the Accelerator; the COMMS
interface should use port 236 for Serial and 232 for paralell -- this
practice of using that range of ports for other usage was looked down
upon, until port 239 was used by the SAMBus -- so now we've nicked
one.
         _____________________________________________________________
PORT 238:|  7   |   6   |   5   |   4   |   3   |   2   |   1   |   0|
         -------------------------------------------------------------
         |MFACE | CLOCK |I/OWAIT| ASICW |  Mirror bank selection     |
         -------------------------------------------------------------

MFACE will probably be used to switch in and out the multiface ROM;
CLOCK selects either a 6Mhz or 20Mhz clock to the processor (default
is 6, and comes from the SAM),
IOWAIT decides whether or not ASIC Wait states are acted upon during
I/O
ASICW decides whether or not ASIC Waits are countermanded at all --
default is that all ASIC Waits are listened to.
Mirror bank: default is that memory is mirrored to internal RAM.

*grins* don't say I never tell you anything.

> What about persuading him to adapt your *elegant* accelrator into
> a dream-computer, with pipelining and co-prosessors for EVERYTHING?

Erm... problem: we want it to not cost too much money, and be an add-
on for the SAM.

The SAM 2 *is* in the design stages, and currently will be a
specialist multi-media machine -- sold as different things to
different markets. It *will* be SAM compatible, even if it has to be
through an emulator. It will have a GUI as standard, but that will be
switchable to a full-screen shell. Price of less than 1000 pounds
would be preferable. But we don't know yet.

Current design ideas:

Screen modes:
256x300, 320x300, 512x300, 640x300
256x600, 320x600, 512x600, 640x600

all in 256 colours. 24-bit palette. Possibly a true-color 24-bit mode.

will come with genlocking (to an extent; at the very least, graphics
on video overlaying), chroma-key, and a video digitiser built in to
boot.

Sound:
SAA1099 for compatibility (as they only cost about 5 pounds),
64-channel, 8-16 bit, stereo, 256 volume levels per channel sampled
sound playback chip; max playback rate of at least 66kHz. Possibly
built in sound digitiser.

+------------------INTERNET: CSL@FS2.EE.UMIST.AC.UK-------------------+
| "You know... you can tell someone's vain when they quote themselves |
|           in their own .sig file..." -- Simon Cooke                 |
+--------------------JANET: CSL@UK.AC.UMIST.EE.FS2--------------------+

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Fri Apr 29 11:44:05 1994
From: Nigel J Kettlewell <N.J.Kettlewell@dcs.warwick.ac.uk>
Message-Id: <3780.199404291026@stone>
Subject: Re: BBB ?
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Fri, 29 Apr 1994 11:26:44 +0100 (BST)
In-Reply-To: <6A6832C2D47@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk> from "Simon Cooke" at Apr 29, 94 10:21:44 am
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL20]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
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Status: RO
Content-Length: 806
Lines: 26

> > Oh dear Bob. Still no sign of Format, tho no doubt they'll have some at the
> > show. Now that he's _published_ a complete lie, this is _much_ worse than it
> > was before, as he's doing me down in print, by the sound of it.
> 
> *grins* in a moment I'm off to a library to find some law books and
> photocopy the statutory consumer rights bill..

Cheers Simon, that would be great. If I can get to read what he's said in
Format by tomorrow morning, and it's what it sounds like, then I'm going to
have a right old go at him at the show...and of course he doesn't know who I
am to look at me, so I can hopefully get him to say something incriminating
before I tell him my name...

> 
> That should show him where to shove his stipulatory SAE's
> 

hear hear.

> Si


Nige




From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Fri Apr 29 12:00:09 1994
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
From: Simon Cooke <CSL@fs2.electrical-engineering.umist.ac.uk>
Date: 29 Apr 94 11:09:32 GMT
Subject: Re: BBB ?
Priority: normal
X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail v2.3 (R4).
Message-Id: <6A74F7A669E@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk>
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 1513
Lines: 39

> From:          Nigel J Kettlewell <N.J.Kettlewell@dcs.warwick.ac.uk>
> Subject:       Re: BBB ?
> To:            sam-users@nvg.unit.no
> Date:          Fri, 29 Apr 1994 11:26:44 +0100 (BST)
> Reply-to:      SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>

> > > Oh dear Bob. Still no sign of Format, tho no doubt they'll have some at the
> > > show. Now that he's _published_ a complete lie, this is _much_ worse than it
> > > was before, as he's doing me down in print, by the sound of it.
> >
> > *grins* in a moment I'm off to a library to find some law books and
> > photocopy the statutory consumer rights bill..
>
> Cheers Simon, that would be great. If I can get to read what he's said in
> Format by tomorrow morning, and it's what it sounds like, then I'm going to
> have a right old go at him at the show...and of course he doesn't know who I
> am to look at me, so I can hopefully get him to say something incriminating
> before I tell him my name...
>
> >
> > That should show him where to shove his stipulatory SAE's
> >
>
> hear hear.
>
> > Si
>
>
> Nige

Problem: I ain't got a clue where to get the SCRB (stat consumer
rights thingy) from. I'll try Manchester Central.

Si

+------------------INTERNET: CSL@FS2.EE.UMIST.AC.UK-------------------+
| "You know... you can tell someone's vain when they quote themselves |
|           in their own .sig file..." -- Simon Cooke                 |
+--------------------JANET: CSL@UK.AC.UMIST.EE.FS2--------------------+

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Fri Apr 29 12:00:17 1994
From: Nigel J Kettlewell <N.J.Kettlewell@dcs.warwick.ac.uk>
Message-Id: <6036.199404291057@stone>
Subject: Re: BBB ?
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Fri, 29 Apr 1994 11:57:10 +0100 (BST)
In-Reply-To: <6A6D1235C02@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk> from "Simon Cooke" at Apr 29, 94 10:39:55 am
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL20]
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Status: RO
Content-Length: 2686
Lines: 79

> > Yeah! I am still wondering WHAT's so elegant about it :) I guess if
> > I keep these postings coming, I'll never know. :)
> 
> Ooooh.. well...
> 
> Let's put it this way; it uses a 0.5Mb memory mirror with controlled
> wait states and read-writes, and has a 20Mhz processor in it.
> Basically, the Z84C0020 (20 Mhz z80, now called by me the Z80X), acts
> on decision control logic:
> 
> If reading from internal RAM, read only from mirror mem, and ignore
[...]

This sounds very clever, a little bit like a CPU cache in fact... Right?

> 
> If doing an I/O and control port is set to do so, ASIC WAITs will be
> ignored. This is only in as a test feature -- both Bruce and myself
> don't know if it'll work if I ignore the WAITs during I/O.
> 

>From my own experiences in the lab here, WAITs for I/O are vital, but I'm
no expert...

> We were thinking of using a FIFO memory so that ports and memory
> could be accessed that way, giving even more increased speed, but
> decided against it.
> 

How do you mean, exactly?

> Current hardware details:
> 
> Memory: 512kb
> Processor: Z84C0020
> Logic: 3 octal latches *so far*, various gating and switching logic.
> Will have a thru' connector, and sockets on the board for an
> expansion to turn it into the SAM equivalent of a MultiFACE.
> 

Presumbly snapshotting one lot of 512k in the other?

> SAMBus will have to be connected *into* the thru'connector. Probably.
> 

I remember trying to get all my Speccy add-ons in the right order, ie one
that works! The NMI line for the Multiface was quietly ignored by some things,
which was a real pain.

>          _____________________________________________________________
> PORT 238:|  7   |   6   |   5   |   4   |   3   |   2   |   1   |   0|
>          -------------------------------------------------------------
>          |MFACE | CLOCK |I/OWAIT| ASICW |  Mirror bank selection     |
>          -------------------------------------------------------------

Of course, you could put other things besides a multiface thingy in there,
just plug in the ROM you want, really...

> 
> *grins* don't say I never tell you anything.
> 
> > What about persuading him to adapt your *elegant* accelrator into
> > a dream-computer, with pipelining and co-prosessors for EVERYTHING?
> 
> Erm... problem: we want it to not cost too much money, and be an add-
> on for the SAM.

Any price estimates yet? Hopefully the 512k memory won't be as much as
SAMCo (used to) & West Coast charge, which is crazy cash.

> Si 

oops. Can't comment any more, as I've got a lecture to go it in about -2
minutes.

Bye
Nige



From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Fri Apr 29 12:53:34 1994
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
From: Simon Cooke <CSL@fs2.electrical-engineering.umist.ac.uk>
Date: 29 Apr 94 11:39:41 GMT
Subject: Re: BBB ?
Priority: normal
X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail v2.3 (R4).
Message-Id: <6A7D00B48A3@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk>
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 3228
Lines: 85

> This sounds very clever, a little bit like a CPU cache in fact... Right?

Erm.. not really. It's an exact copy of the SAM's internal memory --
just you read from that instead of the SAM's memory, allowing you to
ignore Video contention totally.

Bruce came to the same conclusion. Then I explained it again to him :)

> > If doing an I/O and control port is set to do so, ASIC WAITs will be
> > ignored. This is only in as a test feature -- both Bruce and myself
> > don't know if it'll work if I ignore the WAITs during I/O.
> >
>
> >From my own experiences in the lab here, WAITs for I/O are vital, but I'm
> no expert...

Mmmm... that's what I was thinking, but it'll be in for tinkerers.

> > We were thinking of using a FIFO memory so that ports and memory
> > could be accessed that way, giving even more increased speed, but
> > decided against it.
> >
>
> How do you mean, exactly?

Well... it's sort of a cache. Any memory writes would be all stored
in a long memory buffer, and then done when there's time -- thus
removing *ALL* read/write wait conditions to the internal memory.
Thus it'd run at full whack. Unfortunately that'd cost at least
another 30 pounds.

> > Current hardware details:
> >
> > Memory: 512kb
> > Processor: Z84C0020
> > Logic: 3 octal latches *so far*, various gating and switching logic.
> > Will have a thru' connector, and sockets on the board for an
> > expansion to turn it into the SAM equivalent of a MultiFACE.
> >
>
> Presumbly snapshotting one lot of 512k in the other?

Nope... it's already in there -- it just has to be looked at :)

> >          _____________________________________________________________
> > PORT 238:|  7   |   6   |   5   |   4   |   3   |   2   |   1   |   0|
> >          -------------------------------------------------------------
> >          |MFACE | CLOCK |I/OWAIT| ASICW |  Mirror bank selection     |
> >          -------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Of course, you could put other things besides a multiface thingy in there,
> just plug in the ROM you want, really...

Sort of... ish... but there'll be a ROM board coming out soon to
handle that. Also, it'll work on the same lines as the Hard Drive
BIOS selection.

> > *grins* don't say I never tell you anything.
> >
> > > What about persuading him to adapt your *elegant* accelrator into
> > > a dream-computer, with pipelining and co-prosessors for EVERYTHING?
> >
> > Erm... problem: we want it to not cost too much money, and be an add-
> > on for the SAM.
>
> Any price estimates yet? Hopefully the 512k memory won't be as much as
> SAMCo (used to) & West Coast charge, which is crazy cash.
>

Erm... possibly 80 pounds.

>
> oops. Can't comment any more, as I've got a lecture to go it in about -2
> minutes.
>
> Bye
> Nige

*lol* I see... neglecting your studies eh??? Me too :)

Si
+------------------INTERNET: CSL@FS2.EE.UMIST.AC.UK-------------------+
| "You know... you can tell someone's vain when they quote themselves |
|           in their own .sig file..." -- Simon Cooke                 |
+--------------------JANET: CSL@UK.AC.UMIST.EE.FS2--------------------+

From imc Fri Apr 29 14:14:34 1994
Subject: Re: BBB ?
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Fri, 29 Apr 94 14:14:34 BST
In-Reply-To: <6A6D1235C02@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk>; from "Simon Cooke" at Apr 29, 94 10:39 am
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]
Content-Length: 281
Lines: 9

On 29 Apr 94 10:39:55 GMT, Simon Cooke said:

> Let's put it this way; it uses a 0.5Mb memory mirror with controlled
> wait states and read-writes, and has a 20Mhz processor in it.

So why bolt it on to a Sam?  Surely it would be much better as a separate
computer.

imc

From imc Fri Apr 29 14:20:30 1994
Subject: Re: BBB ?
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Fri, 29 Apr 94 14:20:30 BST
In-Reply-To: <6A7D00B48A3@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk>; from "Simon Cooke" at Apr 29, 94 11:39 am
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]
Content-Length: 695
Lines: 16

On 29 Apr 94 11:39:41 GMT, Simon Cooke said:
> Well... it's sort of a cache. Any memory writes would be all stored
> in a long memory buffer, and then done when there's time -- thus
> removing *ALL* read/write wait conditions to the internal memory.

So something like "PUSH HL: POP IX" won't work properly?  Oh yes, the
memory is mirrored so that might be OK.  But still, how does the Sam's
own processor know how long to wait before it can read things?

> > Any price estimates yet? Hopefully the 512k memory won't be as much as
> > SAMCo (used to) & West Coast charge, which is crazy cash.

Maplins sell large memory SIMMs which seem to be quite cheap at the
moment :-)

imc

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Fri Apr 29 14:25:45 1994
From: frodet@ulke.dhmolde.no (Frode Tennebo)
Message-Id: <9404291322.AA11537@ulke.dhmolde.no>
Subject: Re: BBB ?
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Fri, 29 Apr 1994 15:22:21 +0200 (MET DST)
In-Reply-To: <3780.199404291026@stone> from "Nigel J Kettlewell" at Apr 29, 94 11:26:44 am
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21]
Content-Type: text
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 816
Lines: 16

> > *grins* in a moment I'm off to a library to find some law books and
> > photocopy the statutory consumer rights bill..
> 
> Cheers Simon, that would be great. If I can get to read what he's said in
> Format by tomorrow morning, and it's what it sounds like, then I'm going to
> have a right old go at him at the show...and of course he doesn't know who I
> am to look at me, so I can hopefully get him to say something incriminating
> before I tell him my name...

You'r a mean guy.... :)

-- 
* Frode Tennebo                        * It's better to live life in     *
* email: frodet@ulke.dhmolde.no        * wealth and die poor, than live  * 
*        Frode.Tennebo@dhmolde.no      * life in poverty and die rich.   *
* snail: Parkv. 31, 6400 Molde, NORWAY *                   -Frode Tennebo*

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Fri Apr 29 15:00:36 1994
Message-Id: <swordfish.767627867@minster.york.ac.uk>
From: gaw-a@minster.york.ac.uk (Geoff Winkless)
Date: Fri, 29 Apr 1994 14:39:19 +0100
In-Reply-To: Ian.Collier -- "Re: BBB ?" (Apr 29, 3:14pm)
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92 (ORBIT))
To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Subject: Re: BBB ?
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 1048
Lines: 22

On Apr 29,  3:14pm in "Re: BBB ?", you warbled:
] On 29 Apr 94 10:39:55 GMT, Simon Cooke said:
] 
] > Let's put it this way; it uses a 0.5Mb memory mirror with controlled
] > wait states and read-writes, and has a 20Mhz processor in it.
] 
] So why bolt it on to a Sam?  Surely it would be much better as a separate
] computer.

Ahh... but if you sell it for the Sam: a) you have the keyboard and system
software sorted out, and b) you have this massive (haha) user base to sell
it to...

Put it this way, if it really is 80 quid, I'm gonna mortgage my parents
house to buy it... on top of the hard drive and the MiDGET, of course :)

Geoff 		        (gaw-a@minster.york.ac.uk / gaw2@york.ac.uk -- INET)
       __  __   __  An  expert  is  someone | I may be wrong: I thought we said
|\  /||  ||  ) ( _) who can read the system | It couldn't happen here... -  PSB
||\/|||--||-(  _\\  manual   pages   faster | These  opinions  are  my  own. If
||  |||  ||  \(__/  than anyone else...     | anyone  agrees,  more  fool them.


From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Fri Apr 29 15:00:41 1994
Message-Id: <swordfish.767627890@minster.york.ac.uk>
From: gaw-a@minster.york.ac.uk (Geoff Winkless)
Date: Fri, 29 Apr 1994 14:38:06 +0100
In-Reply-To: Ian.Collier -- "Re: BBB ?" (Apr 29, 3:20pm)
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92 (ORBIT))
To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Subject: Re: BBB ?
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 1018
Lines: 22

On Apr 29,  3:20pm in "Re: BBB ?", you warbled:
] So something like "PUSH HL: POP IX" won't work properly?  Oh yes, the
] memory is mirrored so that might be OK.  But still, how does the Sam's
] own processor know how long to wait before it can read things?

Yes, it will...

And the point is that the z80 in the sam doesn't work at all -- at least, 
that was my understanding of the operation. 

] Maplins sell large memory SIMMs which seem to be quite cheap at the
] moment :-)

Yup... I was going to suggest that myself, actually. I was even thinking of
`doing' my own SIMM upgrade board for the SAM.

Geoff 		        (gaw-a@minster.york.ac.uk / gaw2@york.ac.uk -- INET)
       __  __   __  An  expert  is  someone | I may be wrong: I thought we said
|\  /||  ||  ) ( _) who can read the system | It couldn't happen here... -  PSB
||\/|||--||-(  _\\  manual   pages   faster | These  opinions  are  my  own. If
||  |||  ||  \(__/  than anyone else...     | anyone  agrees,  more  fool them.


From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Fri Apr 29 15:00:46 1994
Message-Id: <swordfish.767627933@minster.york.ac.uk>
From: gaw-a@minster.york.ac.uk (Geoff Winkless)
Date: Fri, 29 Apr 1994 14:39:43 +0100
In-Reply-To: N.J.Kettlewell -- "Gloucester show" (Apr 29, 11:13am)
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92 (ORBIT))
To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Subject: Re: Gloucester show
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 606
Lines: 16

On Apr 29, 11:13am in "Gloucester show", you warbled:
] It might be a bit late, but Bob's instructions for getting to the show
] tomorrow are as follows:

[cut]

Not too late at all!

Thanks, nige!

Geoff 		        (gaw-a@minster.york.ac.uk / gaw2@york.ac.uk -- INET)
       __  __   __  An  expert  is  someone | I may be wrong: I thought we said
|\  /||  ||  ) ( _) who can read the system | It couldn't happen here... -  PSB
||\/|||--||-(  _\\  manual   pages   faster | These  opinions  are  my  own. If
||  |||  ||  \(__/  than anyone else...     | anyone  agrees,  more  fool them.


From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Fri Apr 29 15:32:37 1994
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
From: Simon Cooke <CSL@fs2.electrical-engineering.umist.ac.uk>
Date: 29 Apr 94 14:03:28 GMT
Subject: Bob Brenchley Update: The Law.
Priority: normal
X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail v2.3 (R4).
Message-Id: <6AA35463F1A@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk>
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 1340
Lines: 32


Well, folks, it looks like we may be able to do dear Bobby under:

Sections 14 & 15 of the Sale of Goods Act (1979),
The Advertising Standards Act
Trades Descriptions Act

It also seems that, after doing a little research, although I'm not
sure how this applies to mail order, he is obliged *by law* to
collect the faulty discs himself -- I think this translates to him
having to pay for any postage incurred.

Your stand and the law:

You do not have to accept credit notes if you have not asked for them
explicitly -- you may decline the note and ask for payment in full.

You can request as well as your refund, compensation -- such as for
price of postage, photocopying etc, and also for hire of equipment
meant to do the job you had bought the thingy for.

This has been simon cooke, toasted, tired and having spent 3 hours
cutting through a swathe of legal texts, absolutely bloody knackered.

Oh yes, and the Citizens Advice Bureau was closed when I got there --
I was going there to check up just in case.

Si
+------------------INTERNET: CSL@FS2.EE.UMIST.AC.UK-------------------+
| "You know... you can tell someone's vain when they quote themselves |
|           in their own .sig file..." -- Simon Cooke                 |
+--------------------JANET: CSL@UK.AC.UMIST.EE.FS2--------------------+

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Fri Apr 29 16:16:34 1994
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
From: Simon Cooke <CSL@fs2.electrical-engineering.umist.ac.uk>
Date: 29 Apr 94 14:29:49 GMT
Subject: Re: BBB ?
Priority: normal
X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail v2.3 (R4).
Message-Id: <6AAA5986007@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk>
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 805
Lines: 23

> On 29 Apr 94 10:39:55 GMT, Simon Cooke said:
>
> > Let's put it this way; it uses a 0.5Mb memory mirror with controlled
> > wait states and read-writes, and has a 20Mhz processor in it.
>
> So why bolt it on to a Sam?  Surely it would be much better as a separate
> computer.
>
> imc

Because I don't want to have to devise video graphics circuitry,
sound circuitry and add on the cost of an extra .5 Mb Memory, casing,
components, drive controllers, drives, PSU..........

Simple eh?

Si


+------------------INTERNET: CSL@FS2.EE.UMIST.AC.UK-------------------+
| "You know... you can tell someone's vain when they quote themselves |
|           in their own .sig file..." -- Simon Cooke                 |
+--------------------JANET: CSL@UK.AC.UMIST.EE.FS2--------------------+

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Fri Apr 29 16:45:45 1994
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
From: Simon Cooke <CSL@fs2.electrical-engineering.umist.ac.uk>
Date: 29 Apr 94 14:39:35 GMT
Subject: Re: BBB ?
Priority: normal
X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail v2.3 (R4).
Message-Id: <6AACF346B37@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk>
Reply-To: SAM mailing list <sam-users@nvg.unit.no>
Status: RO
Content-Length: 938
Lines: 19

> > > *grins* in a moment I'm off to a library to find some law books and
> > > photocopy the statutory consumer rights bill..
> >
> > Cheers Simon, that would be great. If I can get to read what he's said in
> > Format by tomorrow morning, and it's what it sounds like, then I'm going to
> > have a right old go at him at the show...and of course he doesn't know who I
> > am to look at me, so I can hopefully get him to say something incriminating
> > before I tell him my name...
>
> You'r a mean guy.... :)

No he's not... and besides, it's me who's just spent 3 hours
researching it all --should see how mean I am now!!!

Si
+------------------INTERNET: CSL@FS2.EE.UMIST.AC.UK-------------------+
| "You know... you can tell someone's vain when they quote themselves |
|           in their own .sig file..." -- Simon Cooke                 |
+--------------------JANET: CSL@UK.AC.UMIST.EE.FS2--------------------+

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Fri Apr 29 16:45:52 1994
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
From: Simon Cooke <CSL@fs2.electrical-engineering.umist.ac.uk>
Date: 29 Apr 94 14:39:02 GMT
Subject: Re: BBB ?
Priority: normal
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> On 29 Apr 94 11:39:41 GMT, Simon Cooke said:
> > Well... it's sort of a cache. Any memory writes would be all stored
> > in a long memory buffer, and then done when there's time -- thus
> > removing *ALL* read/write wait conditions to the internal memory.
>
> So something like "PUSH HL: POP IX" won't work properly?  Oh yes, the
> memory is mirrored so that might be OK.  But still, how does the Sam's
> own processor know how long to wait before it can read things?

Uhuh - but the r/w buffer would only be used in a specific bank of
128k of memory -- thus allowing it to be used at the programmer's
discretion.

The SAM's own processor doesn't know a thing -- it's quite nicely
kept busy with a well placed 0v on the BUSRQ line :)

> > > Any price estimates yet? Hopefully the 512k memory won't be as much as
> > > SAMCo (used to) & West Coast charge, which is crazy cash.
>
> Maplins sell large memory SIMMs which seem to be quite cheap at the
> moment :-)

*grins* well... depends on access time. We're looking for 80ns at the
moment, due to the speed of the processor involved.

Si
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From imc Fri Apr 29 16:47:39 1994
Subject: Re: BBB ?
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Fri, 29 Apr 94 16:47:39 BST
In-Reply-To: <6AACD1728DB@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk>; from "Simon Cooke" at Apr 29, 94 2:39 pm
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On 29 Apr 94 14:39:02 GMT, Simon Cooke said:
> *grins* well... depends on access time. We're looking for 80ns at the
> moment, due to the speed of the processor involved.

If I remember correctly, some are 70ns and some are 80ns.  Also, some of
them are 9 bits wide...

imc

From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Fri Apr 29 18:44:41 1994
From: frodet@ulke.dhmolde.no (Frode Tennebo)
Message-Id: <9404291741.AA13856@ulke.dhmolde.no>
Subject: Re: BBB ?
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
Date: Fri, 29 Apr 1994 19:41:26 +0200 (MET DST)
In-Reply-To: <6AACD1728DB@fs2.ee.umist.ac.uk> from "Simon Cooke" at Apr 29, 94 02:39:02 pm
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> > On 29 Apr 94 11:39:41 GMT, Simon Cooke said:

> The SAM's own processor doesn't know a thing -- it's quite nicely
> kept busy with a well placed 0v on the BUSRQ line :)

I haven't had the time to study the specs in detail, but it
seems to me that suspening the Z80B is a terrible waste of
resources. What about letting the Z80X use the Z80B as a 
co-processor? Fix it up with a separate ram-block, or a way
to pass PC to it, and then enable it with an I/O command?

Any thoughts?


-- 
* Frode Tennebo                        * It's better to live life in     *
* email: frodet@ulke.dhmolde.no        * wealth and die poor, than live  * 
*        Frode.Tennebo@dhmolde.no      * life in poverty and die rich.   *
* snail: Parkv. 31, 6400 Molde, NORWAY *                   -Frode Tennebo*

From sam-users-owner@nvg.unit.no Fri Nov 18 14:10:04 1994
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From: gaw-a@minster.york.ac.uk (Mars Bar)
Date: Fri, 18 Nov 1994 13:50:35 +0000
In-Reply-To: D.J.Doore -- "Re: Interesting Sam News" (Nov 18, 1:34pm)
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On Nov 18,  1:34pm in "Re: Interesting Sam News", Dan warbled:
] 
] Today Mr. Anonymity spat:
] 
] > JUNK EMAIL??? What the **** do you call this crap?
] 
] *sigh* if I _have_ to explain it to you...

No, you don't. I meant what did you call the crap that you're posting to
the group. And I'm not going to write any more because this is crap aswell.

Well I don't mind bein' the first on the floor, if that's what it takes to make
you _MOVE_. Don't let your spirit or your head hang low, just feel your body
and get into the groove... Let The Music Lift You Up...


From sam-users-request@nvg.unit.no Fri Apr 29 20:49:23 1994
To: sam-users@nvg.unit.no
From: Simon Cooke <CSL@fs2.electrical-engineering.umist.ac.uk>
Date: 29 Apr 94 15:07:25 GMT
Subject: Re: BBB ?
Priority: normal
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> ] So something like "PUSH HL: POP IX" won't work properly?  Oh yes, the
> ] memory is mirrored so that might be OK.  But still, how does the Sam's
> ] own processor know how long to wait before it can read things?
>
> Yes, it will...

Erm... yep, you're right.  Hadn't thought it thru' properly -- but
the FIFO is still something we were only *thinking* about. It's
nothing definite yet. The rest of the design holds.

> And the point is that the z80 in the sam doesn't work at all -- at least,
> that was my understanding of the operation.

Uhuh -- you're right. Picture This:

            BUSRQL o-----------------------------o GND
                            ^ PCB track
                   ^ pad                         ^ pad

 *grins*

> ] Maplins sell large memory SIMMs which seem to be quite cheap at the
> ] moment :-)
>
> Yup... I was going to suggest that myself, actually. I was even thinking of
> `doing' my own SIMM upgrade board for the SAM.

*smiles* anybody wanting to knock out cheap 1Mb's is quite welcome to
do so. BtW: We'll be producing the SAM Bus soon. Let's get the
accelerator and the midget out of the way first tho' :)

> Geoff               (gaw-a@minster.york.ac.uk / gaw2@york.ac.uk -- INET)

Si
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| "You know... you can tell someone's vain when they quote themselves |
|           in their own .sig file..." -- Simon Cooke                 |
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